Corbett vs Kid Mccoy was it a fake? and why?

[Benny The Kid]

As a historian i have great trouble with this fight.
Aug 30th 1900
James Corbett vs Kid Mccoy.

Having read most of Mccoy's fighting accounts prior to this bout. He had to be an overwhelming favorite in my mind.

Few boxers ever hit the scene with as most success as Mccoy.

In 1899 he went through a prime Tom Sharkey giving him one of his worse beating up until that point in time.
He defeated all the greats of the time Joe Goddard Joe Choynski peter Maher and a top lightheavyweight in Steve O donnell.

Before he took his original absence from the ring in 1904 he was dynamite in the ring.

Corbett would be a huge name on his resume i'm not sure why he would not want a victory against him.

Box rec indicates he almost certainly faked his knockout.

Did Mccoy ever address this later in life?

Here's a detailed account from the next day: Chicago Tribune Aug 31st 1900 I love how they write back in the day.

The blow that ended the battle was a hard left to the body which doubled up Mccoy like a boy with the colic. He held his stomach with his hands and made wry faces until he was sure the referee had counted him out. He rose partially once, as if in doubt weather the referee really had counted enough, and then dropped back down again til there could be no mistake.

It was hard to make one's self believe the men were not acting. So playful and kittenish were they in the first two rounds that Terry Mcgovern remarked "i could not fight that way. That's in a parlor"

Even the fast work of the last two rounds and the kockout were unable wholly to dispel the impression of artificially and feigning. At the end one had the same feeling as a person coming away from a clever but decadent play. He wants to take several long good breaths of fresh air and drink of cool, clear water to take the taste out of your mouth.

It appears no doubt what happened here.

Mccoy in reading his newspaper accounts never fought like this. He was superior on defense and moved very fast physically boxed at a breakneck pace. Corbett just playful dispels the notion that he is superior.

I just personally see McCoy kicking his ass in a real fight. Corbett i don't feel would knock him out and would never be able to keep up with the youth and pace Mccoy would set and more so he would have a tough time hitting him. I think Mccoy has the better chin he took bombs in the sharkey fight and didn't stop. He was in the dead center of his prime.

I'm not looking at them from a life review of greatness. I'm saying Mccoy was unstoppable at this point in time.
Corbett was off his fight with Jeffries and at least shook off some rust.

The fight was scheduled for 25 rounds.

It's horrible history robbed us out of settling whom was better. It basically took the steam out of Mccoy's career i can't help but wonder if his questionable choices in the Corbett fight haunted his future as he basically quit boxing within a few years. I do know he suffered a hand injury that slowed him down.

I'm really curious if Mccoy had any thought's about it after his career.

Mccoy is like several boxers of the early age you just can't gather much looking at Box rec.

Reading about Mccoy the newspapers loved him he was a machine in the ring, slashing about weaving in & out. Id start with reading the Sharkey fight. You'll really appreciate how great he was. Regardless of your option's of him almost no one hit the boxing scene with more impact than him prior to 1900. He was unbeatable fighting as a super middleweight range with tremendous power before he had hand issues. I'm not sure what was going to stop him he was like a middleweight Jack Dempsey. He been through the ring wars already with the great one Tommy Ryan. I'm not sure whom was going to stop him but i think he would have beat Corbett. Then the real match would of been Fitzsimmon's vs Mccoy. The Match was attempted by newspaper accounts. That would have been something special.

I guess Mccoy really paid for his mistake with Karma it certainly wasn't good to him. None of it makes any sense to me. He was fighting often at the time he had money why would he get so desperate? To sabotage his career. He was the king at the time it makes no sense.

[Caractacus]

did you know that the famous director D.W Griffith use to work out with him ?
He also was in one of his films BROKEN BLOSSOMS.

[Caractacus]

here is some rare footage of the two re-enacting the fight in 1912
( Corbett was 46 yrs old and McCoy 40 yrs old)

[Caractacus]

[Senya13]

Did Mccoy ever address this later in life?

McCoy claimed he had learned about his wife (Julia) being unfaithful to him (with his close friend Frank) a couple of weeks before the Corbett fight was to take place, and that he couldn't train properly and he didn't care about the fight anymore, but that he and Corbett didn't have any agreement prior to the fight.

[Ambling Alp II]

Without seeing film, it seems likely that McCoy was off his game. Corbett still had something left at the time. Upsets happen.

[Caractacus]

Corbett was only about 34 years old
also he had the expierence of course.
McCoy was about 24 .
Corbett also writes about this fight in his 1925 autobiography THE CROWD ROARS.
he said he heard rumours 2 days before the fight that McCoy was planning to "lay down"
but Corbett thought it was a traick.
He said MCoy became demoralized after the fifth round lost his disapline and 'fell apart"
and Corbett hit him to the body more then a few times.

[mattdonnellon]

Sharkey Ko'd McCoy in ten, McCoy was nearly 28, Corbett coming 34, for the record. Personally, I am very surprised Corbett beat the Kid, if real it was his best-ever win.

[Caractacus]

What was the "Tale of the Tape " ?
wasn't McCoy previously the (undisputed) Welter-weight Champion ?
Corbett was still only 34 and still a "Lean Mean Fightin" Machine".
sheeyat, if Corbett hadn't already making a laundry list at the start
of the 26th round in his previous fight, he would have once again been HW Champ in 1900.

[mattdonnellon]

https://www.newspapers.com/image/526899 ... oy&match=1

[Caractacus]

Hey man,

would you type it out what it reads here and also transcribe
what it says because Im on a fixed income and cant afford a subscribition to newspapers.com at this time.
thank you

[Senya13]

The Topeka state journal. [volume], August 30, 1900, LAST EDITION, Image 1
https://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lccn ... d-1/seq-1/

[mattdonnellon]

Thanks Senya! Came on to do a load of typing!

[Caractacus]

here are a few of those measurments listed there

Jim J. Corbett -- Kd McCoy
ht - 6 ft 1" - 5 ft 10 and 3/4ths
wt - 181 lbs - 170 lbs
reach - 78" - 76"
age - 34 - 27
neck- 17" - 16"
chest- 42"- 37"
bicep - 14"- 14"
wrist- 7.5- 7.5
waist- 32" - 34"
thigh- 22"- 21.5
calf-14 and 3/4ths - 15.5"

[Caractacus]

naw, it wasn't a fake.
Gentleman Jim" noticed McCoy was faling apart loosing his composure and wildly swinging after the fifth round and also noticed McCoy looked soft around the mid-section, so Corbett threw numerous body punches.
McCoy collapsed in a heap and the ref just called it a win for Corbett without even counting to ten.
McCoy beat "The Dancing Master" himself ? NO WAY.

[mattdonnellon]

Corbett's bio was very self-proclaiming so I'd be careful with it. The Kid's wife was the chief accuser at the time and very bitter so hard to say. Most scribes at the time felt it was rotten.

[Caractacus]

well, sheeyatt, if you dont "toote" your own horn ,who's gonna ?

[Ambling Alp II]

Somebody else.

[Benny The Kid]

It's seems rather "fishy" As i typed that Mccoy was getting up but went back down after he noticed the count wasn't high enough.

That's much more proof that he "faked" it than to use speculation that has no facts behind it. That was a first hand ringside account.

I wouldn't doubt that a relationship took his heart out of the match, The Kid had notorious trouble in that department.

Almost every indicator has the fight super tame. With the kid barely extending himself.

The crowd was very much displeased hooting & yelling fake far before the knockout happened.

I never read any accounts i can remember of a guy going back down during a referee count. They even say he got right back up after the fight was over!

Like i said i have no idea why he would sabotage himself like that other than money.

The kid did not fight slow at all in previous fight's it was out of character for him. Maybe he was severely out of shape it's possible i did read he had some fat around his midsection. But too many thing's don't add up for me.

I would also very much like to point out the fact that Mccoy's biggest rival whom he faced previously Tommy Ryan also had a few "fake fight's" on his resume. So it would appear he obviously learned some distasteful tactic's from him. No previous comments seemed to make that connection.

The fake fight's were very prevalent in that time period.

Usually the crowd will be indicating it (but not always true) prior to the knockout. As documented in the newspapers.
This is just a clue not an kind of empirical evidence. But they were certainly yelling it in this match.

By all the evidence i would lean towards the theory he did "fake" the match for reason's unknown to me. But I'm certainly not convinced of the matter. But the fact that Tommy Ryan was doing it and Philadelphia Jack O' Brien did it after him faking bouts. You'd have to certainly think it was very realistic possibility.

Even Tom Sharkey is indicating before the fight Mccoy has to be the favorite. In the article provided.
Mccoy clearly read's like he isn''t trying very hard.

The crowd yelling fake in the specific Tommy Ryan bouts was clearly correct. I would tend to believe they may be on to something.

[Caractacus]

McCoy probably wasn't able to land a glove on Jim J. Corbett
( thats why he "went to pieces after the 5th round)
This song is dedicated to "The Dancing Master"

[Ambling Alp II]

It's seems rather "fishy" As i typed that Mccoy was getting up but went back down after he noticed the count wasn't high enough.

That's much more proof that he "faked" it than to use speculation that has no facts behind it. That was a first hand ringside account.

I wouldn't doubt that a relationship took his heart out of the match, The Kid had notorious trouble in that department.

Almost every indicator has the fight super tame. With the kid barely extending himself.

The crowd was very much displeased hooting & yelling fake far before the knockout happened.

I never read any accounts i can remember of a guy going back down during a referee count. They even say he got right back up after the fight was over!

Like i said i have no idea why he would sabotage himself like that other than money.

The kid did not fight slow at all in previous fight's it was out of character for him. Maybe he was severely out of shape it's possible i did read he had some fat around his midsection. But too many thing's don't add up for me.

I would also very much like to point out the fact that Mccoy's biggest rival whom he faced previously Tommy Ryan also had a few "fake fight's" on his resume. So it would appear he obviously learned some distasteful tactic's from him. No previous comments seemed to make that connection.

The fake fight's were very prevalent in that time period.

Usually the crowd will be indicating it (but not always true) prior to the knockout. As documented in the newspapers.
This is just a clue not an kind of empirical evidence. But they were certainly yelling it in this match.

By all the evidence i would lean towards the theory he did "fake" the match for reason's unknown to me. But I'm certainly not convinced of the matter. But the fact that Tommy Ryan was doing it and Philadelphia Jack O' Brien did it after him faking bouts. You'd have to certainly think it was very realistic possibility.

Even Tom Sharkey is indicating before the fight Mccoy has to be the favorite. In the article provided.
Mccoy clearly read's like he isn''t trying very hard.

The crowd yelling fake in the specific Tommy Ryan bouts was clearly correct. I would tend to believe they may be on to something.

Regarding him getting up and going down again - It is conceivable that he was badly hurt, got up and fell down again with out being hit again. Without seeing it, not saying that is what happened, but it is possible.