Off Topic : France will play WC Finals !!

Raff The Frenchman · Post by **Raff The Frenchman** » 05 Jul 2006, 16:50

im just so happy about it, just wanted to shout

jomothepure · Post by **jomothepure** » 05 Jul 2006, 16:58

A very well done sir. Slightly understated tonight, but job done. It will be an interesting, if perhaps not an 8-goal thriller, against Italy on Sunday. Fingers crossed it will get near to reproducing last night's eipc.

I would certainly love France to win it, for the players if nothing else. Zidane in particular is an exceptional player, and this would be a just and fitting end for him.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 05 Jul 2006, 17:12

The Portugese were at it yet again the dirty little pudenda. Throwing themselves about and crying to the referee. Was nice to see Ronaldo in tears at the end the little wankstain. They really have been a bunch of wankers from first game to last.

Raff The Frenchman · Post by **Raff The Frenchman** » 05 Jul 2006, 17:18

they should have been penalized for throwing themselves on the ground...

what's most funny is that in their newspaper just before the game, had for title : "we're going to pluck them" with a plucked french rooster...

looks like the hairy guys got their asses shaved by Mr Zidane

E · Post by E » 05 Jul 2006, 19:23

It's not the french team, it is the French colonies team..........

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 06 Jul 2006, 04:23

Your point being?

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 06 Jul 2006, 06:03

GO FRANCE!

E · Post by E » 06 Jul 2006, 06:03

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Your point being?

My point being - what is an 'acceptable' criterion for supporting a team?

Why is it 'acceptable' to support a team simply because of what passports they hold, but not because you relate to the players more.

IE nationalism in relation to sport is acceptable according to the allowances designated by the thought police; but not culturalism, or any other factors relating to choice of support.

It doesn't make any rational/moral sense.

I am half French, but find it hard to support the FRench football team.

Why? I don't feel that close to the players - every team has its immigrant players; I have no problem with that - but when it is 80% of the team then it loses its cultural character.

The Frenchness I am close to culturally, is the France that I connect to, the literature, the way of life, the attitude.

Immigrants carry a lot of their own culture to their new country and I do not relate to this in the same way.

I mean do you think that Algerian immigrants feel French? How many british born Asians/Pakistanis do you think support England in cricket? How many British Afro-caribeans do you imagine support England over the West Indies in cricket....

If you can find me one I will buy myself a Patrick Viera poster.

PS Zinedine Zidane is one of my favourite players.

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 06 Jul 2006, 07:20

totally mixed up rationale.

what makes a person support any side is a completely personal thing.
it can be anything, the way a team celebrates, the way a team plays, the way they are fair, the way they perhaps are a little bit tricky, the colour of the shirts, the fact that your grandma once had a nice holiday in the country. dont try to make a case for [i]rationalising[/i] why people support who they do because i'll tell ya now you're on a loser

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 06 Jul 2006, 07:21

and it can even be because its the country where you were born!!!

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 06 Jul 2006, 07:28

E wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:Your point being?
My point being - what is an 'acceptable' criterion for supporting a team?

Why is it 'acceptable' to support a team simply because of what passports they hold, but not because you relate to the players more.

IE nationalism in relation to sport is acceptable according to the allowances designated by the thought police; but not culturalism, or any other factors relating to choice of support.

It doesn't make any rational/moral sense.

I am half French, but find it hard to support the FRench football team.

Why? I don't feel that close to the players - every team has its immigrant players; I have no problem with that - but when it is 80% of the team then it loses its cultural character.

The Frenchness I am close to culturally, is the France that I connect to, the literature, the way of life, the attitude.

Immigrants carry a lot of their own culture to their new country and I do not relate to this in the same way.

I mean do you think that Algerian immigrants feel French? How many british born Asians/Pakistanis do you think support England in cricket? How many British Afro-caribeans do you imagine support England over the West Indies in cricket....

If you can find me one I will buy myself a Patrick Viera poster.

PS Zinedine Zidane is one of my favourite players.

So you obviously don't think that France's immigrant communities are part of the 'french way of life.'

I would guess this is why there is a lot more racial tension in Paris than there is in London. London's immigrant communities have transformed the city over centuries of cultural interchange, kebab shops and curry houses are just one of many examples. Music, fashion, language, literature, food etc are all influenced by immigrant communities, but from what I understand it, this is NOT the case in Paris, where the immigrant communities are ghettoised. I don't know about other major french cities.

Slapsie Maxie · Post by **Slapsie Maxie** » 06 Jul 2006, 07:39

well put, James

Being part of the immigrant community in London ( after a fashion as I was brought up up North )

I can certainly attest to the fact that, while there are problems in London, the acceptance and embracing of the immigrant cultures is what makes London such a special place

In Paris, Madrid and increasingly in Germany, the isolation politically and economically as well as socially is creating a keg of tension that is likely to explode as it already has done in Paris

Slapsie

El Raincoat · Post by **El Raincoat** » 06 Jul 2006, 07:56

I hope France win it would be a brilliant way for Zidane to finish his career.

Anyone know why Mavuba or Mexes didn't make the squad are they injured ?

Raff The Frenchman · Post by **Raff The Frenchman** » 06 Jul 2006, 08:14

fornicate i hate to hear this kind of BS...like people saying French football team is the african football team...

every player in this team is french...they are all french and have french culture no matter their skin color or parent's birthplace...

and about all those riot shits, i live in Paris and there wasnt that many...

it has all been a huge mediatic fuss, because the media had nothing to talk about at that moment and decided they were going to hype it up...

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 06 Jul 2006, 08:52

I understand the train of thought.

I didn't like British passport holding, born in Britain people cheering Pakistan on in the Cricket.

But then I realised, I still support Yorkshire and my kids, though likely to be born down south will support Nottingham Forest (as I do) and be told they're special because of the affiliation to Yorkshire.

(BTW It makes me cry to think my sons wont be able to say they're from Yorkshire)

And then it dawns on me....that really the two trains of thought cant co-exist.

So if a British man feels more at home or akin to the West Indies or Pakistan or wherever - who am I to argue he's rejecting his nationality and insulting the British tax payer?
?

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 06 Jul 2006, 08:57

Lots of people support more than one team. I always supported Ireland and England in the world cup finals, as my family is Irish, and I live here. What's wrong with that, the world isn't black and white, and someone can have alliegance to MANY different ideas, ethos or groups at once.

E · Post by E » 06 Jul 2006, 11:26

harrygreb wrote:
what makes a person support any side is a completely personal thing.
it can be anything, the way a team celebrates, the way a team plays, the way they are fair, the way they perhaps are a little bit tricky, the colour of the shirts, the fact that your grandma once had a nice holiday in the country. dont try to make a case for rationalising why people support who they do because i'll tell ya now you're on a loser

Yes well that is exactly my point - I don't support the French football team because I don't feel like they represent the France I enjoy/am part of.

But I shouldn't be criticized for this.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 06 Jul 2006, 11:45

Yes you should, you are obviously a racist.

kevo · Post by **kevo** » 06 Jul 2006, 11:45

Raff The Frenchman wrote:smeg i hate to hear this kind of BS...like people saying French football team is the african football team...

every player in this team is french...they are all french and have french culture no matter their skin color or parent's birthplace...

and about all those riot shits, i live in Paris and there wasnt that many...

it has all been a huge mediatic fuss, because the media had nothing to talk about at that moment and decided they were going to hype it up...

Slightly off topic, but what happened to that French rapper who was being prosecuted because it was was claimed his lyrics helped spark the riots? Saw the story on the news and havn't heard anything since.

Raff The Frenchman · Post by **Raff The Frenchman** » 06 Jul 2006, 18:22

E wrote: Yes well that is exactly my point - I don't support the French football team because I don't feel like they represent the France I enjoy/am part of.

you mean the white christian part?

E · Post by E » 06 Jul 2006, 18:30

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Yes you should, you are obviously a racist.

blah blah - that old chestnut. Instead of discussing a topic reasonably, close off all dialogue by calling someone a 'racist'.

You yourself are prejudiced, just against targets you deem accpetable. You are against the establishment, tradition and anyone who disagrees with your POV.

Let me run some amateur psychology - you were never comfortable /accepted by mainstream society (either by way of ugliness, bad dress sense, social awkwardness or all three) and so you reject everything that you deem to to be a part of this.

L-O-S-E-R

E · Post by E » 06 Jul 2006, 18:37

Raff The Frenchman wrote:
E wrote: Yes well that is exactly my point - I don't support the French football team because I don't feel like they represent the France I enjoy/am part of.
you mean the white christian part?

In the main, yes. You must be the brains in the family?

Raff The Frenchman · Post by **Raff The Frenchman** » 06 Jul 2006, 18:39

E wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote:
E wrote: Yes well that is exactly my point - I don't support the French football team because I don't feel like they represent the France I enjoy/am part of.
you mean the white christian part?
In the main, yes. You must be the brains in the family?

nop, my whole family is full of brains, but no need to have much brains to understand that you are a racist...

E · Post by E » 06 Jul 2006, 18:45

Raff The Frenchman wrote:
E wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote: you mean the white christian part?
In the main, yes. You must be the brains in the family?
nop, my whole family is full of brains, but no need to have much brains to understand that you are a racist...

and what is your definition of a 'racist', so that I understand what you are labelling me?

Raff The Frenchman · Post by **Raff The Frenchman** » 06 Jul 2006, 19:08

somebody who defines himself, his belonging by his race/religious class...

you consider yourself as white/christian and despite belonging to the french country, despite France has nearly half of its population from imigration, despite there are millions of arab/black french people, because the football team has not enough white people you don't feel it represents you...

thats why you are a racist...im not a racist because i don't define myself as white, but as human, and as french...i don't care if Zidane is arab, i don't care if Henry or Vieira are black, they were born in France, they speak french, they read french, they eat french, they buy french, they love France, their country, and they'll win for all the french, they are proud to be french...

therefore they represent France and im proud to have them represent France on the football stadium