How about Muhammand Ali? Sure he occupied a nitch in time between the slow cumversome heavyweigthts of similar or smaller size. But, he had all he could handle with bascially a one-handed cruiserwight (Joe Frazier) and a fighter who would crumble against anyone with power (Ken Norton).
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes. And, against big, fast guys like those that exist today, he would have crumpled like a garbage can.
Talk about myths!!!!
Most overrated boxer of all-time
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Borinken25
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 721
- Joined: 08 Jul 2005, 12:28
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
I think you need to go to rehab and stop using drugs; they are seriously affecting your judgment. Look at his record and the fighters that he defeated.TigerMoth wrote:How about Muhammand Ali? Sure he occupied a nitch in time between the slow cumversome heavyweigthts of similar or smaller size. But, he had all he could handle with bascially a one-handed cruiserwight (Joe Frazier) and a fighter who would crumble against anyone with power (Ken Norton).
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes. And, against big, fast guys like those that exist today, he would have crumpled like a garbage can.
Talk about myths!!!!
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
[quote="Borinken25"][quote="TigerMoth"]How about Muhammand Ali? Sure he occupied a nitch in time between the slow cumversome heavyweigthts of similar or smaller size. But, he had all he could handle with bascially a one-handed cruiserwight (Joe Frazier) and a fighter who would crumble against anyone with power (Ken Norton).
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes. And, against big, fast guys like those that exist today, he would have crumpled like a garbage can.
Talk about myths!!!![/quote]
I think you need to go to rehab and stop using drugs; they are seriously affecting your judgment. Look at his record and the fighters that he defeated.[/quote] Well, very intelligent argument on your part. So, for example you might want to explain how he would have won another talented, but, much larger heavyweight such as Lennox Lewis.
Isn't it obvious that Ali used his reach and size to great advantage and this would not exist against many of today's fighters. Using Lennox Lewis, now retired, as an example.
Or how about this, a small, inexperienced agressive fighter with less than 10 professional fights beat Ali, Spinks, so, how would Holyfield have done?
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes. And, against big, fast guys like those that exist today, he would have crumpled like a garbage can.
Talk about myths!!!![/quote]
I think you need to go to rehab and stop using drugs; they are seriously affecting your judgment. Look at his record and the fighters that he defeated.[/quote] Well, very intelligent argument on your part. So, for example you might want to explain how he would have won another talented, but, much larger heavyweight such as Lennox Lewis.
Isn't it obvious that Ali used his reach and size to great advantage and this would not exist against many of today's fighters. Using Lennox Lewis, now retired, as an example.
Or how about this, a small, inexperienced agressive fighter with less than 10 professional fights beat Ali, Spinks, so, how would Holyfield have done?
Another thoughtful reply
[quote="BoxBuzz"]...are you sure you really thought that post completely through before you pressed the "submit" button? Not to worry...the "edit" button can be your friend.[/quote]
Ali would always use his left, grearter reach against most fighters of his time, to hold his oponent away, how would he have done this against either of the Klistcho brothers?
Ali would always use his left, grearter reach against most fighters of his time, to hold his oponent away, how would he have done this against either of the Klistcho brothers?
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generic screen name
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 631
- Joined: 11 Feb 2006, 16:28
Why even compare Ali and Lewis. Ali's a legend. He beat a prime Sonny Liston, came back against the #2 contender Quarry (who does that nowadays?), beat Frazier 2x, a prime Foreman, did great in one of the deepest heavyweight divisions of all time. Lewis, although it wasn't all his fault, its always about who he can POTENTIALLY beat.
Calling Ali the most overrated boxer ever is stupid, now if you want to argue #1 heavyweight all-time, go right on ahead.
Calling Ali the most overrated boxer ever is stupid, now if you want to argue #1 heavyweight all-time, go right on ahead.
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HomicideHenry
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 18722
- Joined: 08 Sep 2005, 00:43
I think Teddy Atlas said it best on Marciano:
'He was over rated because of the 49-0 and under-rated because he beat the best fighters available even if they were older.'
Or something along those lines...was on SPORTSCENTURY's program on Marciano. So Marciano falls into the rare category of being both the most over rated and the most under rated champion(s) in history.
'He was over rated because of the 49-0 and under-rated because he beat the best fighters available even if they were older.'
Or something along those lines...was on SPORTSCENTURY's program on Marciano. So Marciano falls into the rare category of being both the most over rated and the most under rated champion(s) in history.
Re: Another thoughtful reply
Ali had trouble with Frazier cose he(Ali) had no real power.. all Frazier did was pour in like a tide. And Ali outboxed Foreman who had better reach! Also when older he did let those guys quite close to him.TigerMoth wrote:Ali would always use his left, grearter reach against most fighters of his time, to hold his oponent away, how would he have done this against either of the Klistcho brothers?BoxBuzz wrote:...are you sure you really thought that post completely through before you pressed the "submit" button? Not to worry...the "edit" button can be your friend.
I dislike Ali very much and think he was overrated but not by landslide.
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The Great John L
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 4351
- Joined: 26 Jul 2005, 19:37
Re: Another thoughtful reply
Have you ever heard of Ernie Terrell? He was 6’-6” and a MUCH more gifted boxer than both Klits combined, and Ali toyed with him.TigerMoth wrote:Ali would always use his left, grearter reach against most fighters of his time, to hold his oponent away, how would he have done this against either of the Klistcho brothers?
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
Yeah TigerMoth is right, when Ali finally stepped up he was exposed by Spinx, at last someone who knows wahat they're talking about.TigerMoth wrote:Or how about this, a small, inexperienced agressive fighter with less than 10 professional fights beat Ali, Spinks, so, how would Holyfield have done?
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Controversial
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 9153
- Joined: 13 Jul 2002, 18:29
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
Dundee said Ali never trained for this fight as he was so over confident that he would beat Spinks. Also Ali was nearing the end of his career, no way near the fighter he was in his early days.TigerMoth wrote:Borinken25 wrote:Or how about this, a small, inexperienced agressive fighter with less than 10 professional fights beat Ali, Spinks, so, how would Holyfield have done?TigerMoth wrote:
At the end of the day Ali was a great fighter and the fighters he fought are a "who's who" of the heavyweight division. He ducked no-one and beat most of them. The greatest ever is up for debate but one of the very best no doubt.
If anyone is over-rated it is Marciano.
Listen guys, no true heavyweight champion of the world is overrated and if you are a real fan of the sport of boxing you would know this. It is the pinnacle in sports and most prestigious title, so to call one of its champions overrated is ridiculous and insulting. I have no problem comparing or saying Ali was better than Louis or Louis was better than the Rock etc etc. But none of these guys were overrated and anyone saying Rocky was is off the mark. He has the most perfect record in sports history and he was the man for his time. That's all he could do. He beat who was around during his reign. Don't disrespect such class and brilliance.
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Controversial
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 9153
- Joined: 13 Jul 2002, 18:29
I hear what you say however I wasn't meaning to take anything away from Marciano. And your right he beat those put in front of him.walshb wrote:Listen guys, no true heavyweight champion of the world is overrated and if you are a real fan of the sport of boxing you would know this. It is the pinnacle in sports and most prestigious title, so to call one of its champions overrated is ridiculous and insulting. I have no problem comparing or saying Ali was better than Louis or Louis was better than the Rock etc etc. But none of these guys were overrated and anyone saying Rocky was is off the mark. He has the most perfect record in sports history and he was the man for his time. That's all he could do. He beat who was around during his reign. Don't disrespect such class and brilliance.
What I meant by over-rated was how some people rank him the best ever because he was 49-0. Or some people believe Marciano would beat any modern day fighter because he was never beaten. To me that is ridiculous as Marciano fought in a weak era against fighters past their best.
He still is a favourite of mine and always will be. In my opinion though he is often over-rated in his abilities.
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TheRiverCityHippy
- Middleweight
- Posts: 8466
- Joined: 08 Mar 2014, 15:39
you think a guy with wins over sonny liston, joe frazier, george foreman, floyd patterson, archie moore, ken norton, jimmy ellis, jimmy young, buster mathis, ernie terrell, jerry quarry, zora foley, oscar bonavena, george chuvalo, cleveland williams, joe bugner, henry cooper, bob foster, karl mildenberger, ron lyle and ernie shavers (plus a load more i cant think of at the moment) is over rated???
jeez tigermoth, what does a guy have to do to be rated by you?
jeez tigermoth, what does a guy have to do to be rated by you?
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
If Ali had been like everyone from Hector Mercedes, to Carl Williams, then yes Tyson would have beaten him. Tysons prime was over, the very moment Buster Douglas decided to fight back.TigerMoth wrote:How about Muhammand Ali? Sure he occupied a nitch in time between the slow cumversome heavyweigthts of similar or smaller size. But, he had all he could handle with bascially a one-handed cruiserwight (Joe Frazier) and a fighter who would crumble against anyone with power (Ken Norton).
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes. And, against big, fast guys like those that exist today, he would have crumpled like a garbage can.
Talk about myths!!!!
My guess is Muhammed would have decided to fight tyson the day the contract was signed, so no Tyson gets exposed by Ali, easily.
I hope that answers your question, as I'm not even going to mention your accusation about Ali.
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Bill Celender
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 9
- Joined: 22 Feb 2007, 16:20
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Eric the Viking
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 1354
- Joined: 03 Apr 2003, 21:40
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
Ha, ha, some dweeb starts a thread about "most overrated boxer ever", cites Ali as a supposed example, *then* cites none other than the legendary Tin Man, himself, Tyson, as a guy who would've exposed the featherfisted, weak-opponented, crumbly-kneed Ali. Classic - that's almost as legendarily stupid as Damien's legendarily stupid "High Altitude of Cardiif, Wales" thread. Ha, Frazier a "one-handed cruiserweight" ... Ali KTFOs Foreman but has no power ... oh, so many rich nuggets of steaming illogical doo-doo to admire here.TigerMoth wrote:How about Muhammand Ali? ...
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes.
Methinks TigerMoth has bonked into a few too many porch lights during his nighttime flutterings...
Anyone else notice that "TigerMoth" is an anagram of "Mother Git"?
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
That's easy,Jack Johnson.If this guy were even 1/2 the fighter he's believed to be,he'd be awesome.TigerMoth wrote:How about Muhammand Ali? Sure he occupied a nitch in time between the slow cumversome heavyweigthts of similar or smaller size. But, he had all he could handle with bascially a one-handed cruiserwight (Joe Frazier) and a fighter who would crumble against anyone with power (Ken Norton).
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes. And, against big, fast guys like those that exist today, he would have crumpled like a garbage can.
Talk about myths!!!!
zuru
Re: Most overrated boxer of all-time
What kind of drugs do they give in those insane asylums over there in Thailand?TigerMoth wrote:How about Muhammand Ali? Sure he occupied a nitch in time between the slow cumversome heavyweigthts of similar or smaller size. But, he had all he could handle with bascially a one-handed cruiserwight (Joe Frazier) and a fighter who would crumble against anyone with power (Ken Norton).
Yes, he was fast and big for a heavyweight at the time. But, a fast handed, two handed puncher like the early Mike Tyson would have destroyed him like he did Larry Holmes. And, against big, fast guys like those that exist today, he would have crumpled like a garbage can.
Talk about myths!!!!
You are out of your mind or have just temporarily lost it, I have read some pretty dumb, naive, misinformed, outrageous, outlandish, shocking, off the wall, whacked, and downright insane thoughts and comments but your's bud sure takes the cake hands down.
Darwin Award Winner for 2007............................. The honors go to you.
