Herol Graham

Mimmy · Post by **Mimmy** » 12 Mar 2007, 09:13

Has any one any info on this ex pro from Sheffield, one of the best middleweights Britain has ever produced.

JC · Post by JC » 12 Mar 2007, 10:37

There was doco about him on BBC Four a few months back. He seems to be OK if I remember correctly he's got a business he runs from home making skipping ropes (I think) and also works as a personal trainer in Sheffield.

I seem to remember a story about a gym roof collapsing and and almost killing him but very narrowly missing. He also did some kind of charity tour recently to get kids into sport, apparently he's still fit as a butcher's dog too.

Mimmy · Post by **Mimmy** » 12 Mar 2007, 11:54

Good ole Herol, best thing to come out of sheffield!

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 13 Mar 2007, 10:41

Didn't Herol Graham use to do a thing for charity, where he'd have his hands tied behind his back, and for a fee, you could get in the ring with him and try and land a punch. I read something like that in KO Magazine I believe.

icejack · Post by **icejack** » 13 Mar 2007, 11:19

Yes he did,see him on tv doing it against members of the public.Graham was a great defensive fighter,but was never that popular (in london at least ,where in those days nearly all major fights took place) Looking back ,his chance at world titles came about 3 years to late.Yes he was still a good fighter but when he was a jnr.middleweight he was almost un fightable.In those days British promoters (basically Duff and Lawless where big fights were concerned ) couldnt or wouldnt compete with the Bob Arums ,Don Kings of this world so Graham was never in the shake up .Believe Tony Sibson beat him as a amateur.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 16 Mar 2007, 15:36

What's this feud between the Sheffield fighters? With Graham on one side & Johnny Nelson on the other, something like that?

Mimmy · Post by **Mimmy** » 16 Mar 2007, 16:22

most sheffield fighters have a similar way to fight, i think Herol made that style his own and everyone followed it, E.G, Ryan Rhodes, Johhny Nelson, Naseem Hamed.

Mukel · Post by **Mukel** » 17 Mar 2007, 07:36

Herol Graham, the best british boxer to never win a world title,
very unlucky, and he still had it late on into his career when he was beating Brewer.
Also on the recieving end of one of the most brutal knockouts against
jackson...ouch!

walshb · Post by **walshb** » 20 Mar 2007, 05:42

I always thought Graham was a bit of a messer and poser and was not good enough to win a world title. Hagler would have eaten him had they met and Jackson really exposed him

bollox · Post by **bollox** » 20 Mar 2007, 06:46

A fighter like Graham was never going to be appreciated until well into retirement. His defensive skills were brilliant. He could and should have beaten McCallum (and Jackson - ouch) but choked somewhat

JC · Post by JC » 20 Mar 2007, 06:52

walshb wrote:I always thought Graham was a bit of a messer and poser and was not good enough to win a world title. Hagler would have eaten him had they met and Jackson really exposed him

Well the fact that Hagler would have eaten him alive doesn't say much Hagler is probably a top three MW of all time, imagine what he'd do to Taylor.

As for being exposed versus Jackson, Herol clearly won every round untill the stoppage by a very wide margin, it's one of the great come from behind KOs. A flush shot like that from Jackson would have done for almost any middleweight. Graham might also have won a title if he'd taken a knee in the last round against Brewer.

Don't get me wrong I have Graham a knotch below guys like Mcullum from that era, but he had the ability to pick up a title IMO.

Arbachakov · Post by **Arbachakov** » 20 Mar 2007, 09:22

walshb wrote:I always thought Graham was a bit of a messer and poser and was not good enough to win a world title. Hagler would have eaten him had they met and Jackson really exposed him

How did Jackson expose him?.He'd already lost twice and been fighting for 12 or so years by that point.Everyone knew what his strengths and weaknesses were by then.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 20 Mar 2007, 10:49

Herol Graham huh?

http://download.yousendit.com/C58A7E1E037D529C

Mimmy · Post by **Mimmy** » 20 Mar 2007, 12:40

walshb wrote:I always thought Graham was a bit of a messer and poser and was not good enough to win a world title. Hagler would have eaten him had they met and Jackson really exposed him

i'm not sure this is true. Ray Leanard boxed well against hagler, and im sure Herol would have done just as good. im not saying Herol would have beaten Hagler but i would go as far saying he would have done very well.

Graham would have run rings around Eubank, he would have beaten Michael Watson and im not too sure if he could have beaten Nigel Benn.

TheRiverCityHippy · Post by **TheRiverCityHippy** » 20 Mar 2007, 14:04

herol lost a split decision to a prime mike mccallum and was harshly deducted a point for throwing mccallum.
i thought he won that fight.
prime graham would have given anyone a hard time and i dont think its beyond the pale to suggest he could have done a similar job on an aging hagler that ray leonard did, especially a rusty sugar ray.
herol graham was haglers manditory around that time but he chose to fight leonard instead.

granberry · Post by **granberry** » 20 Mar 2007, 14:15

mimmy123 wrote: Ray Leanard boxed well against hagler,

Leonard ran for his life against Hagler.

When he wasn't running he grabbed and held.

Leonard was warned by name by refereee Richard Steal over 30 times for holding, without Steal ever taking a point away from him.

Leonard punched after the bell in 5 out of the 12 rounds against Hagler, while 'referee' Steal stood by and smiled.

Leonard threw 5 or 6 punches after the bell ending the 11th round. While the ref said nothing.

Gene Fullmer said after seeing that fight, "How can you TAKE A TITLE by running away?"

Harold Johnson said after seeing that fight, "I don't give Leonard any credit for running away."

funso banjo baby · Post by **funso banjo baby** » 20 Mar 2007, 15:03

i agree

a few calzaghe-esque happy slap combos and the judges wet themselves............ the greatest middleweight of them all deserved much better

walshb · Post by **walshb** » 22 Mar 2007, 09:32

No way Graham beats Watson, Eubank or Benn. He loses by KO to Benn and Eubank. Graham just didn't hit hard enough or have the chin or heart to hang with Benn and Eubank and Watson was a better boxer. Graham was one dimensional and when pressure was put on him he usually folded.
Maybe he would have a chance V Hagler of 1987 as Marvin was useless at this stage, but a peak Hagler beats Graha in 3-4 one sided rds.

He was ahead in the Jackson fight, but he was far from dominating. He never hurt Jackson once, he was outboxing him but not putting any hurt on Julian and Jackson was far from a difficult guy to outbox

Arbachakov · Post by **Arbachakov** » 22 Mar 2007, 10:38

I'm not a big fan of Graham, but that's garbage.

What fight did he fold when pressure was put on him?.Or show a lack of heart in.

He was kicking jackson's ass, backing him up at will and had staggered him once or twice.The fight was laughably one-sided until he got overconfident and too aggressive.

dr_devious · Post by **dr_devious** » 22 Mar 2007, 11:19

granberry wrote: Leonard ran for his life against Hagler.

When he wasn't running he grabbed and held.

Leonard was warned by name by refereee Richard Steal over 30 times for holding, without Steal ever taking a point away from him.

Leonard punched after the bell in 5 out of the 12 rounds against Hagler, while 'referee' Steal stood by and smiled.

Leonard threw 5 or 6 punches after the bell ending the 11th round. While the ref said nothing.

Gene Fullmer said after seeing that fight, "How can you TAKE A TITLE by running away?"

Harold Johnson said after seeing that fight, "I don't give Leonard any credit for running away."

This somewhat contradicts your last posts about Hagler, where you basically said he was crap. Now you are saying Leonard ran away from him and stole his title. Which is it to be, is Hagler crap, did Leonard steal his title, or are they both crap?

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 22 Mar 2007, 15:14

The biggest mistake Hagler may well have made in his entire career was complaining about Harry Gibbs being nominated as one of the judges for the Leonard fight. Gibbs was replaced by Jose J. Guerra who scored the fight 110-118, for Leonard.

Gibbs watched the fight at home on TV and scored it for Hagler.

As for Herol Graham one of the best UK fighters to never win a World title, but he was not THE best as is often stated. At times he was a marvel to behold, other times fustrating. Around 1986-87 he could have given Hagler fits with his elusive style but lacked the durability to beat him. Graham vs Frank Tate for the title may have been Herols best chance around that time.

But to to his elusive and awkward/spoiling style he was king of the 'Who needs him' club for many a year.

dr_devious · Post by **dr_devious** » 22 Mar 2007, 17:44

Herol Graham came within a whisker of beating Mike McCallum for the WBA middleweight title. He also came very close to stopping Julian Jackson before getting bombed with a lucky punch. He wasnt exposed in that fight, that punch would have felled a mule. He was probably the best Brit in modern times not to win a world title.

bollox · Post by **bollox** » 23 Mar 2007, 05:12

Herol Graham trivia - he beat one John Mugabi at the world junoir championships in 1976

generic screen name · Post by **generic screen name** » 23 Mar 2007, 08:05

walshb wrote:I always thought Graham was a bit of a messer and poser and was not good enough to win a world title. Hagler would have eaten him had they met and Jackson really exposed him

Jackson exposed him w/the only good punch he threw the whole fight???? How is that possible?

Mimmy · Post by **Mimmy** » 23 Mar 2007, 14:03

walshb wrote:No way Graham beats Watson, Eubank or Benn. He loses by KO to Benn and Eubank. Graham just didn't hit hard enough or have the chin or heart to hang with Benn and Eubank and Watson was a better boxer. Graham was one dimensional and when pressure was put on him he usually folded.
Maybe he would have a chance V Hagler of 1987 as Marvin was useless at this stage, but a peak Hagler beats Graha in 3-4 one sided rds.

He was ahead in the Jackson fight, but he was far from dominating. He never hurt Jackson once, he was outboxing him but not putting any hurt on Julian and Jackson was far from a difficult guy to outbox

Folded??? eh!!!