Sonny Liston's age

wouter · Post by **wouter** » 01 Nov 2002, 07:44

For anyone who wonders how old he really was..... according to allvitalrecords.com the 1930 U.S. census data are accessible now.
You have to subscribe to that website to check its records, but maybe there's an easier ( read: cheaper) way to get access to the data.

overhand_right · Post by **overhand_right** » 01 Nov 2002, 10:45

his date was never recorded. he was born on a slave ranch before it was compulsory for all births to be recorded i think.

whatever they have, surely it will only be what sonny decided to claim when he filled out the form. his age changed maNY TIMES.

wouter · Post by **wouter** » 01 Nov 2002, 11:09

I know there's no officicial birthcertificate, but the one thing you'll know is whether he was already born by 1930 and what his age approx. was.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 25 Apr 2005, 08:17

The same thing happened with Marvin Hagler.

He suddenly became 2 years younger after he became Middleweight champ!!!

overhand_right · Post by **overhand_right** » 25 Apr 2005, 13:43

Sonnys real DOB will never be known & no way should it be listed on boxrec without some kind of explanation next to it i.e. it changed MULTIPLE times throughout his career.

As it is, boxrec currently list his falseified DOB on his record. No surprise there.

wouter · Post by **wouter** » 25 Apr 2005, 13:46

Come on... if it's listed here it must be true

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 25 Apr 2005, 19:59

Liston looks 5-10 years older than his stated age, atleast.

Alister · Post by **Alister** » 26 Apr 2005, 05:51

Liston's official year of birth was 1932. The story goes that Liston's father had 25 children with two different women. He would carve the dates of his children's birth on a tree near where they lived so he wouldn't have to remember the dates. But one day the owner of the land had chopped the tree down and all the Liston siblings "lost" their birthday. On the other hand, Liston's father was habitually cruel towards his children and may not have given a shit when they were born. We'll never know for sure.

Recent research places Liston's birth around 1927. Supposedly he had a 17 year old daughter when he challenged Floyd Patterson for the title i 1962. It's not impossible that he had, but it's more likely that he was older than 13 years of age when she was born. In any event, I think it's safe to suggest that he was older than his official age.

Alister

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 26 Apr 2005, 07:52

Nick Tosches wrote a very in depth book on Sonny Liston, Night Train.
In the book I remember it being wrote that Sonny changed his date of birth many times, and none of them were the one his mother claimed.

I doubt anybody now will ever find out the real year.

JC · Post by JC » 26 Apr 2005, 07:55

tonyevs wrote:Nick Tosches wrote a very in depth book on Sonny Liston, Night Train.
In the book I remember it being wrote that Sonny changed his date of birth many times, and none of them were the one his mother claimed.

I doubt anybody now will ever find out the real year.

I really enjoyed that book the're making it into a film with Ving Raimes (sp) as Sonny,

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0408035/

As far as Sonny's DOB goes I doubt even he knew what it was for sure.

wouter · Post by **wouter** » 26 Apr 2005, 08:14

From thesweetscience.com

Over the years, debate over Liston’s age has waned. The mystery surrounding his birth is usually an addendum to an argument on the tragedy of Sonny Liston. But before you lament his plight, one place has the answer. The 1930 census hit every household in America and, sadly, kept better records than the State of Arkansas. The 1930 census also just became available, since census records are released 72 years after they are collected.

So just how old was Sonny Liston? Was he born before 1930? If you go to the National Archives in Washington, DC and pull up the microfilm for Forrest City, Arkansas you will find Tobin Liston’s 1930 census family card. But Charles L. Liston is not on it. His mother, Helen, is listed, as are his sisters Clytee, Annie and Alcora, and his brothers J.T., Leo and Curtis, who is the youngest at six months. This means that Liston could not have been born before late 1930 and that the oldest he could have been when he fought Ali the first time was 33-years-old.

While there will never be indelible proof of Sonny Liston’s date of birth, one thing is now certain: That was not an old man that Muhammad Ali beat in Miami on February 24, 1964. Sonny Liston may have even been younger than 31 at that time. The 1940 census will be released in 2012. Hopefully this will provide the final piece to one of the many puzzles of Sonny Liston.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 26 Apr 2005, 10:56

Tantum wrote:Liston looks 5-10 years older than his stated age, atleast.

With a life like he'd had, that would be no surprise. Plus I thought that book Night Train was a load of crap. Never been a decent book written on Sonny as far as I can tell.

Best writing on Liston I've come across is Kings Of The World.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 26 Apr 2005, 11:13

I found night train pretentious and boring, the language was impenetrable in places, and it was trying far too hard to be dark and meaningful, didn't enjoy it.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Apr 2005, 15:44

Tony 'two ton' Galento said that he sparred with Liston before his fight with Joe Louis in '39 which suggests that Liston was born perhaps in 1922 as some say.... which isn't too hard to believe!.

JC · Post by JC » 26 Apr 2005, 16:43

But didn't Liston learn to box in prison and 1939 was years before he went inside so it would be unlikely he would be serving as a sparring partener then.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 27 Apr 2005, 14:53

J-C wrote:But didn't Liston learn to box in prison and 1939 was years before he went inside so it would be unlikely he would be serving as a sparring partener then.

Thats the story, but theres always the chance that as a big guy Sonny tried his hand at boxing earlier and was thrown in for sparring with Galento. Also the prison records were not kept and its possible the Liston was in jail much earlier and more times than we know... he may already have been in and out of jail by the late 30s... I could certainly belive that Sonny was born in 1922 or perhaps even earlier.
He had a daughter who was 17 when he won the title also.

Cojimar 1945 · Post by **Cojimar 1945** » 07 Jun 2005, 13:38

I believe the daughter was from Liston's wife's previous marriage. Liston was not the biological father.