OT: 547,001 Brits leaving the UK... who else is coming?

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

I graduated with the sole intention of leaving this place and by golly hat day has come! the date is set for the start of October!

This country has gone to the pits. I'm not one of those people who are emigrating because of immigrants coming into this country, I don't know how anyone can be so stupid as to think as to even come out with an assine reason such as that one. how can someone whinge about immigration runing the country and then immigrate themselves?

I have nothing against immigrants coming here to live, they should have the freedom to come here as I have the freedom to live where I want. As long as they work and abide by the law I have no problem with immigrants.

The reason I'm leaving is the yob culture, it is getting out of control. Yobs are ruling the place now and everyone is scared to do something about.

Couple that with a media and an education system that encourages stupidity and a lack of self responsibility which in turn reinforces the yob culture: Take for example the winners of BB, Brian is a thick as a plank and is going to become famous on the back of it. The twins go to UNIVERSITY! How the hell has that happened.

Add to lazy policemen and inept judges and you have a country thats barely worth a crumb.

I'm outta here... who else is coming?

[jamesmcdonnell]

Well, where is this demi-paradise, this eden to which you are travelling.

England may have it's problems, but where are you going to go that hasn't?

Good luck my friend, but I fear you are in for a dissapointment.

[oliverfennell]

I would like to live abroad but only for the cultural experience, not because I think it would be better elsewhere.

I have travelled a lot and this has given me the perspective that Britain is one of the very best places in the world to live. Most of those who moan do not know how lucky they are.

[jamesmcdonnell]

My dads family live outside Alicante and recommend living abroad but they live on these expat estates that remind me of a sunny version of Wythenshawe and they don't really mix with the local people.

I hope to move abroad to a place like Germany or Madrid. My girlfriend is taking her MA and I'm doing a second one then we hope to be off to anywhere there is a biggish university campus and/or Opus Dei centre.

I'm giving learning Arabic a bash on and off but would try and learn the lingo so I can mix with the local people rather than spending thirty years shouting at them in English.

Carlos, let me know where you are going so we can strike it off our list.

My friend has moved to Berlin. He was born in Brooklyn, lived in New York for the first 10 years of his life, then lived in Kenya and Botswana, then moved to the U.K. He has travelled all over North and South America, all over Europe, South East Asia, and he said that Berlin is without a doubt the best place he has ever lived, and that it absolutely knocks spots off of London in so many respects that he doubts he would ever come back and live in the U.K

I would hate to live in a British Community anywhere, without being a snob, a lot of the people who move to those sort of places are ignorant bigots who spend half their time complaining about the country they live in, and avoiding all contact with the locals, whilst enjoying their 'beautiful' country, and pushing up the prices of the houses.

[oliverfennell]

I would like to live abroad but only for the cultural experience, not because I think it would be better elsewhere.

I have travelled a lot and this has given me the perspective that Britain is one of the very best places in the world to live. Most of those who moan do not know how lucky they are.

same with the states!!

For the record, and I'm not having a dig or trying to open up a new debate, but I believe Britain is a better place to live for two obvious reasons. 1) We get free health care, and 2) We have much lower crime and in particular murder rates (I think you're 10 times more likely to get murdered in the USA than UK).

But having said that, I haven't spent long enough in America to be able to make a more informed opinion than the above, and I do recognise there are some things which are better in the US; namely the cost of living and property, the population density and the amazing range of geography you can experience there. Still, health and crime considerations beat these ones.

[T.M.K]

Mr Wigan,

I do agree with you that the culture of the past 10 years is an absolute f***ing disgrace, and while I will get called facist, racist etc, it is exactly what happens when you have 10 years of Namby-Pamby, left-wing, human-rights, compensation-culture, Labour rule.

Yes there were problems under the conservatives, but labour have lost control whereas it was controlled madness before they came in. Unfortunately no-one seems willing to speak-up that it is generally young-balck-male culture and attitude which is ruining things. Now before someone elaps on me about colour, I use "black" in a cultural sense: and I have met MANY lovely black people who are salt of the earth, and many white people who were almost sub-human, but it is almost this "gangster rap" attitude which has led to "hoodies" and such a rise in the violence of crimes.

I was born in 1979. In the early 90's I got into scrapes and fights like most young lads but I would never have carried a knife or a gun (god forbid, plus I wouldn't have been able to sit down for a month or so if my dad had found out and given me a well-deserved hiding). I now hear of situations I was in as a lad, but instead of fistcuffs and the winner walks away with neither seriously hurt - it is knives and guns, kids losing their lives (like the poor lad in Liverpool yesterday).

But while I agree with everything you said about leaving, I agree with Mr McDonnell & Mr Fennell that it is the lesser of many evils mate, and the grass is not always greener on the other side.

best wishes in your quest

"T.M.K"



ps: I would happily move to France or Belgium (indeed, almost moved to France, then met my wife-to-be and stayed) or indeed my wife's homeland of Germany, but if I did I would integrate, I would not want to live in a Little Britain Clique area, as I don't agree with them (hence, why I dont agree with areas of England with no bloody English people living there and no English being spoken).

pps: I would also only consider moving to those countries as I could live (possibly not work) within their language barriers and without too much difficulty.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Sadly our society seems to be becoming more and more like the states with every passing year. We've become such a materialistic society, personal wealth seems to be all that matters these days, poverty is fast becoming a crime.

Free healthcare will be gone in twenty years time, perhas ten, moves are already underway to see to this. Private healthcare is on the increase, and once people start getting this via their work, or through personal plans as a matter of course, then watch the health service get dismantled piece by piece. Doesn't matter who is in power, at the end of the day, whoever is in government it WILL happen, as they will want to hand this over, like every other major public service, to the fat cats of big business who will get rich on the proceeds of this event.

[Old bones Ian]

i've done a bit of travelling , was gone for 2 1/2 years once, spent some time living in Australia about 18 months, and really enjoyed it.
But i do like living back here as i have all my friends here, of course you can meet new people once you've emergrated, but its not the same as your friends from home.

If i was to choose a place to go, it would be either New Zeland (south island) , or Canada

[oliverfennell]

Good point about the transport network, Terry.

I have, without any exaggeration, experienced more frequent and reliable public transport in some developing countries.

And climate change protesters wonder why people prefer to fly when it costs only marginally more (sometimes less) than the train, and takes a quarter of the time. In fact, even driving yourself somewhere in a gaz-guzzling, polluting car can be cheaper and quicker than the trains - and DEFINITELY cheaper if more than one person is going.

[jamesmcdonnell]

It is terrible. I have tried four times to get the train to Salford (three stops away from Oxford road) to go to Oliver Harrison's gym in the past and only got on the train once.

On two occasions the train was massively delayed and I had to walk because the bus timetable was disrupted.

On another occasion a visit by the Queen led to the cancellation of the train and the bus and guess what? I had to walk.

You try and get a bus from town and there is a breakdown in communication with yourself and the Polish guy driving (who drives like a nutter in my lengthy experience), you almost get killed by warring bus companies trying to pull away from the main stop, the bus stinks, a tramp sits next to you and you have to ask him to move and sit somewhere else, people run over you with their prams and give you a load of gyp for daring to stand in the aisle of a packed bus and then a gang of little feckwits get on and I immediately start to think "I wish I had brought my tazer out today". Not through fear, they just talk this ridiculous slang and if you ask them to move so you can pass they say "Rass, this guy is cheeky yo! He's speaking Chinese to me. Wot you sayin' man. You is cheeky to mi yo. I'm a gangsta mon." and I stand there thinking "You're ginger with freckles mate. I'd knee you in the balls if you had a pair."

Sorry about the rant. I have arranged this weekend jaunt to Ireland by plane easier than my jaunts around this place on train or bus.

That really made me laugh.

Everyone under the age of 25 round my way walks around like they've got a ball and chain tied round one of their ankles, a sort of dipping, foot dragging bowl, which for some reason, when coupled with an anus mouthed sort of 'ganster pout' a frown, and a sideways cap, is supposed to indicate that you are hard/ragga/gansta/strapped/merc etc, etc etc etc.

Sometimes I feel like just punching them in the bollocks really hard and mugging them just for the hell of it. Then I realise there is a fair chance they have a knife, CS Gas or a gun, and think better of it.

I can remember one guy I politely asked to move in a pub and he tells me "Fcuk off, climb over the table."
It ended up with "Do you know who I am?"
To which I replied, "I don't give a fcuk who you are now move you fcking leg," and me barging past. The funny thing was he turned out to be mates with someone I was at the pub with, we shook hands and he apologised and I ended up partying with him a week later.

My point is that levels of civility and common decency are at an all time low, I don't know what the cause of this is, but it's making life shitty for everyone.

The roads in Lambeth make the byways of Sierra Leone look like the Autobahn, potholes the size of the grand canyon unfurling before me every morning as I cycle to work, the edges of the roads rising like a tar tidal wave towards the pavement, and broken bottles and glasses littering the gutter with glass, or stones the size of a quails egg threatening to pitch me off my bike. Sort it out Lambeth!

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Well, where is this demi-paradise, this eden to which you are travelling.

England may have it's problems, but where are you going to go that hasn't?

Good luck my friend, but I fear you are in for a dissapointment.

No-one is talking about a 'paradise' simply a place where I can afford a decent house, a place where my tax money goes on decent social welfare and somewhere where yobs and arsewipes get their just desserts.

There is no nirvana but there are superior places to this.

[jamesmcdonnell]

You may be right Carlos, I wish you luck. Try Berlin mate, it comes highly recommended.

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Carlos, let me know where you are going so we can strike it off our list

No need to worry Terry, seeing as you have moved from you childhood home of Gorton to your present abode of Chortlon on Medlock, a huge distane of 3 miles within the 30 years (?) of your life. I don't think you are moving anywhere real soon.

Some people talk, some people do.

Tu hablo espanol Terry?

[Old bones Ian]

By the sounds of it i'm glad i live on the Isle of Wight
We may be inbreds down here , but i'm 10 minutes stroll from 2 miles of sandy beaches. I don't have any hassle getting to work.
Also we have the weakest chavs in the country , going by the ones i've had run ins with.

[EddieShredder]

I left the UK two years ago, and couldn't be happier....

Don't get me wrong, I miss my friends and family, but the commute, the work, the endless pricks and trouble thats about, the general attitude of half the nation - I don't miss one bit.

I love being somewhere where you can go out for a drink, knowing that theres no chavs, fat slags drinking too much WKD and throwing up everywhere, and little gob-shites all trying to prove who's the hardest, yet they won't ever have a straight tear up with you, just get all their mates to jump in or get tooled up.

I don't hate our country by any means..... it's just not somewhere I'd choose to live anymore.

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

I graduated with the sole intention of leaving this place and by golly hat day has come! the date is set for the start of October!

This country has gone to the pits. I'm not one of those people who are emigrating because of immigrants coming into this country, I don't know how anyone can be so stupid as to think as to even come out with an assine reason such as that one. how can someone whinge about immigration runing the country and then immigrate themselves?

I have nothing against immigrants coming here to live, they should have the freedom to come here as I have the freedom to live where I want. As long as they work and abide by the law I have no problem with immigrants.

The reason I'm leaving is the yob culture, it is getting out of control. Yobs are ruling the place now and everyone is scared to do something about.

Couple that with a media and an education system that encourages stupidity and a lack of self responsibility which in turn reinforces the yob culture: Take for example the winners of BB, Brian is a thick as a plank and is going to become famous on the back of it. The twins go to UNIVERSITY! How the hell has that happened.

Add to lazy policemen and inept judges and you have a country thats barely worth a crumb.

I'm outta here... who else is coming?

i am fascinated by the english language, especially some of the many terms never heard in the usa!!

what is a yob?!?

'Yob' is backslang (a lingo used by Liverpool and London dockers where they say words backwards) for boy but is used as to describe hooligans
usually of a young age.

[jamesmcdonnell]

I'm not taking sides here, but that was very funny Terry.

Carlos, I've 'known' you since vivi.com forum days, and you always seemed a decent enough chap to me, and I know you and Terry have got into one over whatever it was, but come on, let's be fair, what's wrong with staying put where you're from? One of the problems with our society is that nobody puts down roots and stays put any more, they buy a house, make a packet, trade it in, and move out somewhere further out where they get more for their money, and where they can avoid the turmoil of the inner cities, rather than plant their flag and say 'this is my area, and I'm going to do what I can to make it a better place.'

This is part of what has destroyed our society, people would rather move on that make a stand and make a difference.

[dookus]

I live in South Korea, which fifty years ago was one of the poorest places on Earth. It's still classified as a "recently developed" country, yet the transport system beats ten shades of shit out of the UK, I can actually save money here, and I've fallen asleep pissed off my tart in public places without being bothered. Noone has tried to mug me. People don't give me shit. Were it not that I won't be happy until I've had a crack at doing music in the UK (which is still incomparable with anywhere else, music-wise, at least in the underground scene), I would likely never go home. As mentioned earlier in this thread, Berlin is somewhere that I find extremely attractive as an option. The UK has plenty of stuff going for it, but so much is a fornicating joke that we just put up with.

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Mr Wigan,

I do agree with you that the culture of the past 10 years is an absolute f***ing disgrace, and while I will get called facist, racist etc, it is exactly what happens when you have 10 years of Namby-Pamby, left-wing, human-rights, compensation-culture, Labour rule.

Yes there were problems under the conservatives, but labour have lost control whereas it was controlled madness before they came in. Unfortunately no-one seems willing to speak-up that it is generally young-balck-male culture and attitude which is ruining things. Now before someone elaps on me about colour, I use "black" in a cultural sense: and I have met MANY lovely black people who are salt of the earth, and many white people who were almost sub-human, but it is almost this "gangster rap" attitude which has led to "hoodies" and such a rise in the violence of crimes.

I was born in 1979. In the early 90's I got into scrapes and fights like most young lads but I would never have carried a knife or a gun (god forbid, plus I wouldn't have been able to sit down for a month or so if my dad had found out and given me a well-deserved hiding). I now hear of situations I was in as a lad, but instead of fistcuffs and the winner walks away with neither seriously hurt - it is knives and guns, kids losing their lives (like the poor lad in Liverpool yesterday).

But while I agree with everything you said about leaving, I agree with Mr McDonnell & Mr Fennell that it is the lesser of many evils mate, and the grass is not always greener on the other side.

best wishes in your quest

"T.M.K"



ps: I would happily move to France or Belgium (indeed, almost moved to France, then met my wife-to-be and stayed) or indeed my wife's homeland of Germany, but if I did I would integrate, I would not want to live in a Little Britain Clique area, as I don't agree with them (hence, why I dont agree with areas of England with no bloody English people living there and no English being spoken).

pps: I would also only consider moving to those countries as I could live (possibly not work) within their language barriers and without too much difficulty.

Cheers T.M.K, I think the downfall of the country has been ebbing away for the past 25 or so years. It hs come to this point now of a 'feral youth' culture where yobs and gobshites aren't afraid of anyone. Knowing that
police and the judges have no power over them and the said individuals are running rampant.

Is it down to politicians? It is! You are right, and I think it is irreversible as well.

It made me laugh at the time (its not funny really) but I read about some smackhead who was caught stealing from St Helens town centre and as the judge was about to sentence him the smackhad goes 'yeah go on! lets see you jail me! I know the jails are full' and the judge had o give the smackhad a £100 fine.

I know wherever I go (in this case - South Korea) is not a utopia, everywhere has its problems but the anti intellectual culture in this country and the lack of natural justice against yobs, chavs and shithouses is draining me of my energy, it looks like half a million more agree with me.

[J]

yup im off in 18 months or so Singapore or Barbados, with work so minimal hassle in terms of geting all my shit sorted out.

double salery 20% tax for 3 years if and when I come back =no/ tiny mortgage.

Happy days .

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Carlos, let me know where you are going so we can strike it off our list

No need to worry Terry, seeing as you have moved from you childhood home of Gorton to your present abode of Chortlon on Medlock, a huge distane of 3 miles within the 30 years (?) of your life. I don't think you are moving anywhere real soon.

Some people talk, some people do.

Tu hablo espanol Terry?

Less than thirty. More than twenty-five.

I see you left for a while and learned how to spell, that should aid your cause greatly. Now you need to move on from judging people based on sparse information, graduate to lateral thinking and then try forming an intelligent sentence and they may actually allow you to leave the country. In fact I hear they need an albino ape at Barcelona zoo, I'll send you a bag of flour and you may well be in.

I never knew it was a race Carlos. You like to do things fast and get there first. Your bird must be very unhappy. But I won't assume that

25 years old?

I thought you did 4 tours of Beruit?

Who was that with? The 1st battalion, hamas regiment? 8)

Terry, instead of talking about doing things, actually do them! Life rewards action! The school I'm going to teach at in Daegu, South Korea needs some teachers, fancy it?

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

You may be right Carlos, I wish you luck. Try Berlin mate, it comes highly recommended.

Cheers mate!

My sister loves Berlin so I might do in the future.

Hows the boxing coming along?

[Loynesy]

I've lived in Dubai, New York and Berlin - all great places, but I still think London the best place on Earth.

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Tu hablo espanol Terry?

Omnis Determination Est Negatio gets me by Ok Caros, you might like that one

I said under 30 over 25. Do keep up.

The war tours was a joke. Yes I like Islam, you might not. Fair enough.

As for doing things instead of talking about. Two MA's by the time I'm off will set me up nicely, I'm doing things after thinking about them.

There are reasons for each of our time scales Carlos. Life punishes careless action and rewards well-conceived action.

I'll hold out my hand and say "good luck" to you in Korea.

Oh it was a joke? more like a daft fib you got found out on. If you can point out the 'joke' aspect of the absurd bullshit you were coming out with to prove a point. Then let us know.

I've heard Arabic music. I've been given prayer-tapes by Muslims and listened to them. At first they all sound the same. Then not the same. I've listened to lectures by Muslims in which Arabic music is used as a backdrop, that also sounds samey to Western ears but I am sure it has a purpose.

Arabic reggae, though, well it sounds like reggae only foreign innit. Much like French hip-hop or Bangra hip-hop.

I say 'given a spank' often. This, coupled with your intellectual inferiority complex, has lead you off on one. Yes I post here often. I posted on other GB's also and if you can spell and express yourself at some point someone will say you are lording it over everyone and that you are some kind of intelectual snob in the hope others will join in with this line of argument. It is not happening. I can spell and think, it is a sad sign of the times that you think that is a flaw on my part.

Look, you can carry-on providing entertainment for us. I did four tours of Lebanon OT and believe me you are not saying anything new or remotely interesting. I only reply out of courtesy as none of your boxing posts ever stood out enough for me to find you interesting so I thought I would maintain good manners despite finding you dull and repetitive.

3 miles on 25-30 years? not impressive is it? Most people get out of Manchester as soon as possible, if they have anything about them. We both know this.

But I appreciate your gesture and I extended it to you likewise, good luck in whatever you do.

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Omnis Determination Est Negatio gets me by Ok Caros, you might like that one

I'm glad to hear it! all language learning is trial and error and perseverance.