Okay so this is probably gonna sound disrespectful but I was wondering when exactly the sport of amateur boxing started becoming so soft? Now I"m a big boxing fan but the only amateur bouts I see are the Olympics on TV(only shown at like 3am it seems) and some local bouts on occassion.
My grandfather boxed in the military and continued in Golden Gloves after he got out, and he says that back then(the 50's) that amateur fights were pretty much like pro just less and shorter rounds, with slightly quicker stoppages. He says nowadays it's just so completely different that it makes him sick. He always gives the example that in Joe Louis' first amateur fight he was knocked down 7 times, but still got up each time and lost a decision, and that nowadays that is totally unheard of.
So I know that in 84 headgear was required, but that is for lessening the chance of cuts. But when exactly did the stoppages become so quick and so much emphasis be on points? I read recently Emanuel Steward saying that Olympic boxing has pretty much become like a video game, to which I would have to agree.
Again I don't mean to come across disrespectful but I just find the state of the amateurs sad, and that it could very well cause athletes to get hurt when they turn pro, as they wouldn't be used to the pro rules. Is there any chance of amateurs changing any rules and going back to the old/er days?
Question about current amateur rules/state
Stay tuned for rule changes. AIBA is now considering changing some of the international rules. Over the next few years I think you will see some significant changes. Next year the computer scoring will change.
Just for your info, there are KO's in amateur boxing. At the World Golden Gloves tourney there were quite a few stoppages including my son's RSCH win. For the general public that is a KO. I think you should go to some more amateur tournaments including next year's National Golden Gloves in Grand Rapids, MI. I think you will be pleasantly surprised by the level of boxing you will see at that tournament.
Just for your info, there are KO's in amateur boxing. At the World Golden Gloves tourney there were quite a few stoppages including my son's RSCH win. For the general public that is a KO. I think you should go to some more amateur tournaments including next year's National Golden Gloves in Grand Rapids, MI. I think you will be pleasantly surprised by the level of boxing you will see at that tournament.
Pros are pros and amateurs are amateurs and never the twain shall meet. They are totally different sports. I doubt that the amateur rules will change back to "the old days." There's too much of a chance of liability and law suits. I will say that the "shoe shine" days are gone because that type of "pitty-pat" punches are not scored. I happen to like the art and technique shown in amateur boxing - the pure boxing skills as opposed to the pros knockdowns/outs, wrestling, grappling, slapping, blah, blah. I really don't want to see both sports mesh into one.Again I don't mean to come across disrespectful but I just find the state of the amateurs sad, and that it could very well cause athletes to get hurt when they turn pro, as they wouldn't be used to the pro rules. Is there any chance of amateurs changing any rules and going back to the old/er days?
AIBA is "considering" some rule changes but you can bet they won't happen without the consent of the Medical Commission (no headgear, 3-3 minute rounds). We'll just have to wait and see what happens. I just hope we don't lose the amateur sport.
jumping in and out while throwing rabbit punches is not showing skillboxmel wrote:Pros are pros and amateurs are amateurs and never the twain shall meet. They are totally different sports. I doubt that the amateur rules will change back to "the old days." There's too much of a chance of liability and law suits. I will say that the "shoe shine" days are gone because that type of "pitty-pat" punches are not scored. I happen to like the art and technique shown in amateur boxing - the pure boxing skills as opposed to the pros knockdowns/outs, wrestling, grappling, slapping, blah, blah. I really don't want to see both sports mesh into one.Again I don't mean to come across disrespectful but I just find the state of the amateurs sad, and that it could very well cause athletes to get hurt when they turn pro, as they wouldn't be used to the pro rules. Is there any chance of amateurs changing any rules and going back to the old/er days?
AIBA is "considering" some rule changes but you can bet they won't happen without the consent of the Medical Commission (no headgear, 3-3 minute rounds). We'll just have to wait and see what happens. I just hope we don't lose the amateur sport.
p4p1 wrote:jumping in and out while throwing rabbit punches is not showing skillboxmel wrote:Pros are pros and amateurs are amateurs and never the twain shall meet. They are totally different sports. I doubt that the amateur rules will change back to "the old days." There's too much of a chance of liability and law suits. I will say that the "shoe shine" days are gone because that type of "pitty-pat" punches are not scored. I happen to like the art and technique shown in amateur boxing - the pure boxing skills as opposed to the pros knockdowns/outs, wrestling, grappling, slapping, blah, blah. I really don't want to see both sports mesh into one.Again I don't mean to come across disrespectful but I just find the state of the amateurs sad, and that it could very well cause athletes to get hurt when they turn pro, as they wouldn't be used to the pro rules. Is there any chance of amateurs changing any rules and going back to the old/er days?
AIBA is "considering" some rule changes but you can bet they won't happen without the consent of the Medical Commission (no headgear, 3-3 minute rounds). We'll just have to wait and see what happens. I just hope we don't lose the amateur sport.
You know, for every boxer who ends up doing that trying to score points, you get whole fights that are almost foul-free and very exciting, like one that I saw this weekend between two pretty high level open-class boxers.A lot of boxing "fans" want to see two boxers stand toe to toe and slug it out. It happens frequently in novice bouts since quite often they don't use a lot of boxing skills. However, when you see an open-class bout where the boxers use both offensive and defensive skills and throw a lot of punches, it can be some of the best boxing you will ever see. Slipping, blocking, moving, countering, throwing, etc. You will see it all. It happens frequently.
Dennis wrote:A lot of boxing "fans" want to see two boxers stand toe to toe and slug it out. It happens frequently in novice bouts since quite often they don't use a lot of boxing skills. However, when you see an open-class bout where the boxers use both offensive and defensive skills and throw a lot of punches, it can be some of the best boxing you will ever see. Slipping, blocking, moving, countering, throwing, etc. You will see it all. It happens frequently.
Man, I need to hit open class. The stuff novices do is killing me.
Depends, my friend. I'm in the same LBC with Nick Swan; who normally boxes at 165, if he's around this year. I'll probably enter and certainly give it my best shot; I should hopefully have over 10 fights by that time (I'm approaching it right now). So by the time our LBC Golden Gloves start and just our LBC tournament period, I should be entering, a I have over 5 fights, but we'll see. There's no one outstanding in our region at my weight, but there are some very good boxers, so it'll be an experience for sure. I'd rather box guys who know what the heck they're doing though rather than novices who just put their heads down and fling away without any skills.Roberts J wrote:Koyla. Are you boxing open in the GG and are you going to participate in the regionals ? ? ?
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Rodog685, No disrespect to your grandfather at all, but everything looks different as you get older. The old line "when I was a kid" , has gone on for generations and will continue, I still use that line many times, but I think these kids are starting earlier and staying longer than the kids of 2 generations ago. In general most top ranked amateurs in thier early twentys have been training since they were 10, 12, or 13 years olds. There is no doubt that thier were some real warriors back in the day, but crawl up in the ring with any good open class boxer and you will understand very qickly that this sport is still dangerous, the puches are hard and the target is not easy to hit. The brawling style of yesteryear was partially due to the fact that defensive skills were lacking in many of the boxers that started later in thier life. You can still see it today when an inexperienced amateure truns pro and goes up against an experienced amatuer that has just truned. I'm sure that the great John L. Sullivan probably once said " these young kids don't have the grit we did, these pansies are wearing boxing gloves nowadays."
Hal - the problem is that boxing is so subjective. If it was a sport like track & field, you would see world records falling from time to time. The fans that think today's boxers couldn't hang with the boxers from the 50's, 60's, 70's, or 80's are just misinformed. It may seem like some boxers today are not as competitive, but I think that is because some boxers are so skilled that it just appears that way. I would put Floyd Mayweather Jr in against any Jr. Welter or Welter from years past. I would also bet on Wlad Klitschko against many of the best from years past. There is criticism that Wlad doesn't have a chin, but if you get hit by todays HW's you would realize how big, strong and good they are.
Hal you are also correct that boxing today isn't easy or soft. I see a lot of blood, bruises and swelling. Today's boxers are also tough. I see guys trying to compete with broken hands, fingers, knuckles, etc. I see them trying to compete with sprained ankles, broken noses, damaged ligaments and tendons. The doctors will frequently DQ them or us coaches won't let them compete. Many boxers are more than willing to put their bodies at risk. Is that soft? I don't think so. Is the sport safer? Yes, and that is a good thing.
Hal you are also correct that boxing today isn't easy or soft. I see a lot of blood, bruises and swelling. Today's boxers are also tough. I see guys trying to compete with broken hands, fingers, knuckles, etc. I see them trying to compete with sprained ankles, broken noses, damaged ligaments and tendons. The doctors will frequently DQ them or us coaches won't let them compete. Many boxers are more than willing to put their bodies at risk. Is that soft? I don't think so. Is the sport safer? Yes, and that is a good thing.