Pavlik V Trinidad?!

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 19 Feb 2008, 17:58

Yes, according to today's Irish News. If Duddy doesn't impress against Smichet this weekend then the Puerto Rican parades could be exploited for a Pavlik V Trinidad summer showdown. I'm not one bit enthused. How can anyone get excited about recycled names being shovelled out time after time.

Is it me or is Trinidad becoming a world class journeyman? Never thought when he ripped through the Welterweights all those years ago we would see him being used as a top name to pad people's records. It's sad to see :(

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 19 Feb 2008, 18:13

Do you not think Tito might have a little bit of a chance there?

He looked quite sharp at times against Jones and it's basically movers/slick guys he has lost to, he won't have to go looking for Pavlik.

I think it could be a thriller to be honest.

Sure Pavlik a favourite but it could be very entertaining....

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 19 Feb 2008, 20:23

Pavlik isn't all that, but his size and strength will surely be the factor. I might view Wright vs Trinidad again just to see how many body shots landed. We all know the jab was the key (and Kelly has a similar jab to Wright in terms of it being more than just a range finding) - but both Jones and Hopkins landed body shots that were also telling... did Wright? Relatively speaking, Kelly doesn't do Body shots.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 20 Feb 2008, 01:04

Pav would chin him.

Poncey · Post by **Poncey** » 20 Feb 2008, 04:55

Trinidad is a better fight than Duddy, whom I can't see going past 6.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 20 Feb 2008, 05:52

Pavlik wants to defend his titles, and unify the division after being forced into a catchweight with Taylor.

Papa Trinidad says they can't get down to 160. Arum says the fight HAS to be at middleweight. Bit of a non starter, IMO.

Rather see Pavlik-Duddy. At least Duddy is young & exciting. It will still be a draw. If you can get a very winnable, very lucrative bout, take it.

Anyway, Winky Wright is a far more meaningful fight that Tito. After all, he won every round vs Tito. Wright and Abraham are the only 2 fights for Pavlik to go for after Duddy.

Chambers2 · Post by **Chambers2** » 20 Feb 2008, 05:56

Goz wrote:Do you not think Tito might have a little bit of a chance there?

No, not even a molecule of a chance.

I know it's very unlikely to happen now that Calzaghe is at 175 and Pavlik is stopping at 160, but a fight between the 2 would be a cracker IMO

Poncey · Post by **Poncey** » 20 Feb 2008, 06:12

Autobarn wrote:Pavlik wants to defend his titles, and unify the division after being forced into a catchweight with Taylor.

Papa Trinidad says they can't get down to 160. Arum says the fight HAS to be at middleweight. Bit of a non starter, IMO.

Rather see Pavlik-Duddy. At least Duddy is young & exciting. It will still be a draw. If you can get a very winnable, very lucrative bout, take it.

Anyway, Winky Wright is a far more meaningful fight that Tito. After all, he won every round vs Tito. Wright and Abraham are the only 2 fights for Pavlik to go for after Duddy.

Not convinced Wright would be the logical move, as Taylor drew with him and Pavlik beat Taylor, but somehow I think this would be a good fight.

I've read that Wright may not be able to get back down to 160 due to his Kripsy Kreme addictions (no, I@m not joking). Personally, I see absolutely no merit in Duddy facing Pavlik. He's done nothing to deserve a shot.

Pavlik v Abraham is a fight I'd go and see.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 20 Feb 2008, 07:03

There's plenty for Taylor at 168. I think more ppl are willing to give him a pass due to him being weight weakened at 160 (though Pavlik and Miranda clearly were as well, and Allan Green when he moved down for the Miranda catchweight). A fight with Allan Green would be a good start.

I think Wright will go down to fight Pavlik. Wright was obsessed with going back down to 154 for DLH not long ago. With Pavlik pehraps close to becoming a very big star, well, this is WW's chance right now. Wright AND Pavlik would struggle to get down to 160 now.

I think Pavlik needs to try and get Abraham. Unification, etc. But if he can't, then Wright would be the fight IMO, the big fight at middleweight. Before Pavlik moves up. Kelly has limited time to enjoy his titles and so needs to make the important fights ASAP.

I hope WW's ego has been dented a bit. He got too big for his boots, became VERY unappealing, and looked silly up at 175-lbs.

Shirow · Post by **Shirow** » 20 Feb 2008, 07:10

I can't see this happening at all for 3 reasons.

Papa Trinidad doesn't want his boy getting down to within a stone of his best fighting weight.

Bob Arum insists that this fight must be for the titles but...

A quick scan of Tito's record tells me that he has a 50/50 win/loss record at middleweight and his one impressive perfomance at MW was against Joppy 7 years ago (Mayorga doesn't count as a MW).

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 20 Feb 2008, 07:36

Goz wrote:He looked quite sharp at times against Jones and it's basically movers/slick guys he has lost to, he won't have to go looking for Pavlik.

Missed that bit Goz, must have sneezed mate

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 20 Feb 2008, 07:37

Precisely, Pavlik would batter him from pillar to post

Tito is finished, and has been for some time.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 20 Feb 2008, 07:41

I'll have a £500 'lirva' bet with any of you that Tito wins!

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 20 Feb 2008, 07:47

Tito will end up with brain damage if they keep matching him up like this, with Don King grinning all the way to the bank.

Had to laugh at a serious faced Steve Bunce last weekend, breathlessly telling everyone that Bob Arum had said Pavlik was maybe better than Hagler, Monzon etc - like Bob's word is gospel. The same Arum who called Nigel Benn an English version of Marvin Hagler.

Poncey · Post by **Poncey** » 20 Feb 2008, 07:49

MightyWarrior wrote:The same Arum who called Nigel Benn an English version of Marvin Hagler.

You mean he isn't?

Next you'll be telling me Margarito isn't the most avoided fighter on the planet.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 20 Feb 2008, 08:29

Goz wrote:I'll have a £500 'lirva' bet with any of you that Tito wins!

I know what you mean about Tito, you'd think he'd have a outside puncher's chance at 160 against a fair few, but it's a remote chance against Pavlik - who looks to have a very solid chin.

Surviving Miranda he must have.

Plus I think Taylor caught him with some almighty punches in their first fight, to put him in trouble, and a few were round the back of his head, then he goes and sticks his chin out and allows Taylor a free shot...

Taylor found out pretty quickly on Sat night that it was a bit of a fluke, as he came out trying to take Pavlik's head off again in the first, but changed his mind after about 2 mins, as a crunching left and right from KP turned Taylor's tactics to safetly first after that.

Pavlik is due an easy defence after the hard run of fights he's had though, and I suppose a colourful fight with Duddy fits the bill prefectly.

The real fight at 160 is with "top contender" Abrahams though. I think AA's chin is good enough to stand up to Pavlik's bombs, and it'd be a helluva fight. Plus the German's might just be confident enough to make it.

Chambers2 · Post by **Chambers2** » 20 Feb 2008, 10:10

Goz wrote:I'll have a £500 'lirva' bet with any of you that Tito wins!

I'll even give you 10/1 (on our 'lirva' bet)

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 20 Feb 2008, 11:09

MightyWarrior wrote:The real fight at 160 is with "top contender" Abrahams though. I think AA's chin is good enough to stand up to Pavlik's bombs, and it'd be a helluva fight. Plus the German's might just be confident enough to make it.

Abraham's good enough to win that one ,although whether he will is another matter.

Asterix · Post by **Asterix** » 20 Feb 2008, 11:21

stujones wrote:Pavlik isn't all that, but his size and strength will surely be the factor. I might view Wright vs Trinidad again just to see how many body shots landed. We all know the jab was the key (and Kelly has a similar jab to Wright in terms of it being more than just a range finding) - but both Jones and Hopkins landed body shots that were also telling... did Wright? Relatively speaking, Kelly doesn't do Body shots.

In the Taylor rematch it was actually the body shots that hurt Taylor in the 11th round.
Unless Pavlik improves technically he's going to be outboxed at some point in his career (like Taylor could have if he had stamina). But Pavlik is a special fighter. He's obviously very intelligent (if you watch his analysis on FNF and his interviews) and is physically gifted.