More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Eraserhead
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 554
Joined: 14 Dec 2007, 18:46

More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Eraserhead »

http://www.setanta.com/en/Sport/News/Ot ... ts/boxing/
Enzo Calzaghe has told setantasports.com that his son will never fight Kelly Pavlik because the American has not earned the right to meet him, unlike Roy Jones Jnr who he believes will provide the harder bout anyhow.

Calzaghe said his son, who has just announced he is splitting from long-time promoter allegedly, does not care that Pavlik is seen as a dream opponent for many boxing aficionados, insisting the public at large do not know who the Youngstown fighter is.

With the bout with Jones set to be Calzaghe's last, he insists there is no way a meeting with the popular WBC/WBO middlweight champion will ever happen.

"At the end of the day it's never going to happen," Calzaghe told setantasports.com.

"Simply because I don't feel he deserves a shot yet at the big-time. On the back of one performance against a subdued, light fighter.

"There's a vast, vast difference between Gary and Joe Calzaghe. Gary would be the first to say that. It's chalk and cheese.

"I'm not interested in boosting the profile of a fight that aint going to happen. At the end of the day, you've got Carl Froch, you've got everybody coming up with some [fight].

"We want the best available. Someone who I have always admired. Let's be honest about it. Do you think Pavlik deserves to be mentioned on that level? Pound-for-pound as the best fighter in the world?"

The Pride of Wales is expected to meet Jones in September and his trainer said they wanted to take this bout so if the worst-case scenario does happen, he will have lost his undefeated record to a bona fide legend.

"I look at it with a different perspective," Calzaghe added. "Motivation is about will. Will is about passion. Does he care about the public, Joe? No. So why scream about it. I want rewarded. Joe wants to be rewarded. Let this guy [Pavlik] win five/eight different belts.

"Come and talk to me face-to-face, pound-for-pound, somebody who can have a chance to jump the ship.

"Without a question of a doubt. Big Time. He beat Jermain Taylor so what? Joe would have wiped the floor with Jermain Taylor. A Light weight small puncher.

"So we should give a fight to everyone who wants one? 'It's my turn next'.

"Let him earn the right to go into the position. In Britain half the public don't know who Pavlik is, only the connoseurs of boxing.

"It's not bigger than Roy Jones-Calzaghe, its impossible."

The Newbridge gym guru went on to insist that Jones' performance against Felix Trinidad showed that he is not a 'shot fighter' and a tougher opponent than Pavlik.

"That's why we took him," Calzaghe went on. "We wanted people to believe that Joe is not after dead squid.

"That guy's alive and kicking. We were impressed with him last time. That's why we chose him.

"Without question it is the harder fight. But Joe said he wants to go out in flying colours. The best beats the best.

"He's got a right to that claim. He deserves it. Hypothetically, if the s*** hits the fan it happened with an all-time great."
If you managed to understand a word of that tripe, what do you think? For me, brutal knockout wins over Edison Miranda and Jermain Taylor surpass points wins over Jeff Lacy and Mikkel Kessler. Am I crazy to think that? fornicate Enzo and his 'pound for pound' talk. Pavlik doesn't have to earn shit. He's on the exact same level as Joe Calzaghe and he's done it in half the time. He's rapidly becoming a big name headliner in the US and HBO are eating out of his hand.
There is nothing stopping Pavlik-Calzaghe happening aside from the Calzaghes fear of what Kelly brings to the table. What other way can you look at it?

Gwaaaan Roy Jones!
overhand_right
Heavyweight
Heavyweight

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by overhand_right »

It took JC a decade long WBOllocks reign to start fighting the quality of guys Pavlik was both facing and flattening in Miranda & Taylor.

Enzo saw Pavlik up close and thought 'no frickin way am i putting my boy in with that!!'
tonyevs
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 5844
Joined: 08 Feb 2004, 18:13

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by tonyevs »

Enzo does have a point.
There is always another new kid on the block .. and in all fairness Pavlik looks as dangerous as Lacy previously did - yet in years to come regardless what Pavlik goes onto to achieve Roy Jones jr. name will always be viewed as something special.

Pavlik like Froch is not really known to Joe Public - in this country anyway .. and both obviously prove stiff tests, yet the reward is higher with a Jones match up.

I`d love to see Joe fight Pavlik .. but as we know, Joe is after a bumper retirement fight .. and for that Jones is ideal.
states
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 3554
Joined: 26 Jun 2004, 13:40

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by states »

Not fussed. Pavlik's got Abraham to fight, if he wants it.
stujones
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 27503
Joined: 29 Aug 2003, 15:08

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by stujones »

Pavlik is more proven than Lacy, less proven than Kessler... but at least Kessler and Lacy was Joe's weight.

However, the more team Calzaghe mention Pavlik - the more people think that they are avoiding Pavlik.

Jones needs to beat a top ten opponent to warrant a fight with Joe to be called a Super Fight. Same if Tito fought Pavlik. I agree regarding the new kid on the block - I think though its only Bute and Pavlik who are the ones who geniunally could be the heir apparent.
BunglesFingers
Heavyweight
Heavyweight

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by BunglesFingers »

Calzaghe is doing what Steve Collins did towards the end of his reign...avoiding the young, hungry fighter in favour of meaningless fights and big paydays against washed up has beens. Whatever bullshit spin they try and put on it, anyone with half a brain can see what they have planned.

Joe has earned the right to go for the big pocket filler after all this time but the fact that he has already labelled RJJ as finished on several occasions in the past few years including in his own book just shows that he assumes the average boxing fan is as thick as his bulbous wallet.
WildWaylon
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 3223
Joined: 02 Nov 2005, 13:35

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by WildWaylon »

Enzo is hard to understand on two counts. Its hard to understand what the man is actually saying and what you can translate is also difficult to understand because a lot of it is pure bollox. Joe must really regret saying, especially in print, that RJJ is a washed up, past his best fighter, which lets be honest he is. Like Hopkins he can still bang and he wont be easy but Joe shouldnt lose to him. I wouldnt accuse Calzaghe of ducking Pavlik but why risk fighting him for less money when a big payday, with a more certain win against Jones seems the better option. If it is Joes last fight he should retire undefeated which I believe is his ambition. Lets be honest its a 36 year old and a 40 year old, both fighting their last fights, or last couple of fights. A chance for the fans to see two greats go head to head. Let the younger men battle it out amongst themselves and win the belts that Calzaghe unified. OK maybe we would like to see Joe risk it all again as he did against Lacy and Kessler by taking on Kelly Pavlik but IMO Jones is more than enough as a finale bout, he wont be that easy to beat.
chesh
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 1095
Joined: 31 May 2007, 16:05

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by chesh »

WildWaylon wrote:Enzo is hard to understand on two counts. Its hard to understand what the man is actually saying and what you can translate is also difficult to understand because a lot of it is pure bollox. Joe must really regret saying, especially in print, that RJJ is a washed up, past his best fighter, which lets be honest he is. Like Hopkins he can still bang and he wont be easy but Joe shouldnt lose to him. I wouldnt accuse Calzaghe of ducking Pavlik but why risk fighting him for less money when a big payday, with a more certain win against Jones seems the better option. If it is Joes last fight he should retire undefeated which I believe is his ambition. Lets be honest its a 36 year old and a 40 year old, both fighting their last fights, or last couple of fights. A chance for the fans to see two greats go head to head. Let the younger men battle it out amongst themselves and win the belts that Calzaghe unified. OK maybe we would like to see Joe risk it all again as he did against Lacy and Kessler by taking on Kelly Pavlik but IMO Jones is more than enough as a finale bout, he wont be that easy to beat.
Good post, Waylon. Roy could still be surprisingly dangerous. Joe's always been open to a right hand. If BHOP can catch him, RJ can and harder. That lead right he has - even when lying on the ropes - is a thing of beauty. Calzaghe doesn't have the power to stop even this faded version of Jones, but should take it on workrate.
Grilling Machine
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 3159
Joined: 16 Sep 2005, 02:28

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Grilling Machine »

How many American boxing fans have heard of Jones but not Pavlik? I don't believe this to be a question of profile.

Beating Jones, Toney or Holyfield today proves nothing as far as prime-for-prime goes. Utterly meaningless. I quite fancy my chances against Baby Jake.
HughJohnson
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 134
Joined: 22 Jun 2007, 08:02

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by HughJohnson »

Pavlik hasnt proven himself to be best in his own division yet .
oliverfennell
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 5564
Joined: 15 Feb 2007, 06:37

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by oliverfennell »

Let him earn the right to go into the position. In Britain half the public don't know who Pavlik is, only the connoseurs of boxing.
Good point, as Ashira, Pudwill etc were pure box office!
Captain Hook
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 4730
Joined: 07 May 2007, 09:40

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Captain Hook »

BunglesFingers wrote:Calzaghe is doing what Steve Collins did towards the end of his reign...avoiding the young, hungry fighter in favour of meaningless fights and big paydays against washed up has beens. Whatever bullshit spin they try and put on it, anyone with half a brain can see what they have planned.

Joe has earned the right to go for the big pocket filler after all this time but the fact that he has already labelled RJJ as finished on several occasions in the past few years including in his own book just shows that he assumes the average boxing fan is as thick as his bulbous wallet.
I agree to a point, but Lacy and Kessler were not meaningless fights and Hopkins was no gimme. Which means he is giving himself one massive payday against Roy. Hardly a faded Eubank and Benn. Collins was a joke though, really gets my back up that guy.
Autobarn
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 16093
Joined: 05 Jul 2005, 13:01

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Autobarn »

Collins was a good fighter but he was coming to the end when Calzaghe was ready.

If they'd fought, it could have been a fight that took either man to the next level. But then again, when has a WBO champ ever made things clear that they are an excellent champion?

You can't call someone a joke who went in with McCallum, Kalambay, Reggie Johnson, Pyatt, Eubank and Benn.

Enzo Calzaghe does come out with some rubbish. Taylor - "a light weight small puncher." Jones, being higher up in the p4p rankings than Pavlik. "We want the best available": does he think we're all daft?

Like Wildwayon says, Enzo is not articulate, and when you can decipher it, it's all spin. They want the least risk for the best money, they want to promote a fight on the name of a retiring Joe and the name of a once great Jones.

I don't mind. Pavlik v Abraham is a way better fight.
Phenomenal-Nutrition
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 5185
Joined: 10 Feb 2005, 14:53

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Phenomenal-Nutrition »

Eraserhead wrote: For me, brutal knockout wins over Edison Miranda and Jermain Taylor surpass points wins over Jeff Lacy and Mikkel Kessler. Am I crazy to think that? !
Not crazy, but clearly wrong, Miranda I don't think has ever beat a top 10 contender, he has horrible boxing ability and defense. People forget Lacy was on many P4P lists back then, had 5 successful world title fights including ko's over Reid and Vanderpool. Kessler had basically done Calazages job of cleaning out the division by destroying BEyer, beating Mundine and couple of contenders. Taylor lost to a natural welter in Spinks (watch Spink-Taylor and tell me how Taylor won), most had him losing to Winky (I had it a close 7-5 Winky), most had him losing 1 or both Hopkins fights and he laboured with Ouma. Whats more Pavlik arguably lost the last Taylor fight anyway, there was certainly no clear winner in that win.
Khaosai-Galaxy
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 2739
Joined: 29 Apr 2007, 12:15

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Khaosai-Galaxy »

God, what a bunch of fornicating whinging old women


Are some of you completely unable to see further than then end of your own nose?

So in Enzo's opinion Pavlik isnt as deserving as Roy Jones?

Well i agree, ask the paying public who they would rather see, Calzaghe vs Jones or Pavlik and 90% will go for the guy they have head of, Jones

Once again we get another pointless thread from some tiresome prole unable to understand the world away from internet forums
Peter Hick
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 82
Joined: 08 Dec 2007, 14:00

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Peter Hick »

So Peter Manfredo deserved a shot against Joe but Pavlik does not!?

Absolute garbage from Enzo! Truly pathetic!
Dioufy
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 7351
Joined: 16 Sep 2006, 23:09

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Dioufy »

I hate Enzo, because that is truly pathetic - how many of Joe's opponents have deserved this fight more? None.
Khaosai-Galaxy
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 2739
Joined: 29 Apr 2007, 12:15

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Khaosai-Galaxy »

Dioufy wrote:I hate Enzo, because that is truly pathetic - how many of Joe's opponents have deserved this fight more? None.
Lacy, Hopkins, Kessler, Eubank, Mitchell, Reid maybe?

any more?

you "hate" Enzo? a person you have never met, never spoken to and does not affect your life in any way



Thats fornicating sad, man
Dioufy
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 7351
Joined: 16 Sep 2006, 23:09

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Dioufy »

Hopkins and Eubank maybe, but not the rest man. If you think otherwise then you're sad yourself.
Autobarn
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 16093
Joined: 05 Jul 2005, 13:01

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Autobarn »

Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:God, what a bunch of effing whinging old women


Are some of you completely unable to see further than then end of your own nose?

So in Enzo's opinion Pavlik isnt as deserving as Roy Jones?

Well i agree, ask the paying public who they would rather see, Calzaghe vs Jones or Pavlik and 90% will go for the guy they have head of, Jones

Once again we get another pointless thread from some tiresome prole unable to understand the world away from internet forums
we all know that a Jones fight can make money. That TV will be interested in Joe's farewell fight. That a faded name like Jones can still sell a fight - that he's "all the way back" (LOL) after beating Hanshaw and Tito. That HBO will help promote it. That if it's on Setanta, ppl will keep on subscribing for stuff like this.

yes, makes money, makes sense. Pavlik isn't the big time fighter just yet that he will become. So they go for Jones. I think everyone seems to understand this pretty clearly.

But Enzo is talking about deserving, about what fight is most significant to the present p4p line-up. He is talking some rubbish and ppl are objecting to it and rightly so. The Calzaghes have said that Pavlik doesn't want the fight - speaking for Pavlik when really they are turning him down - and now they have changed it to Pavlik doesn't deserve the fight. Joe and Enzo are not straight talking guys - maybe they will make good promoters.

Let them make their killing. Let them have an appalling fight and bow out looking crap. The word "legendary" will be thrown around a lot before the fight. It won't be afterward.
DavidPayne
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 6248
Joined: 11 Mar 2004, 11:00

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by DavidPayne »

This is like Lennox Lewis fighting Mike Tyson in his last fight, instead of Vitali Klitschko.

We all know Tyson was done, but he does the numbers and the fight needed to be done, even the dilute, old version.

Its the same with Jones. Pavlik is the optimum, purists fight.

But Jones renown reaches further.....its an obvious finale.

And though we'll pick JC's record apart now and in the future. Its too late. He's already close to retirement.

He needed Hopkins and Glen Johnson and Clinton Woods - 3-4 years ago.

The window is all but closed.
Khaosai-Galaxy
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 2739
Joined: 29 Apr 2007, 12:15

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Khaosai-Galaxy »

Autobarn wrote:
Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:God, what a bunch of effing whinging old women


Are some of you completely unable to see further than then end of your own nose?

So in Enzo's opinion Pavlik isnt as deserving as Roy Jones?

Well i agree, ask the paying public who they would rather see, Calzaghe vs Jones or Pavlik and 90% will go for the guy they have head of, Jones

Once again we get another pointless thread from some tiresome prole unable to understand the world away from internet forums
we all know that a Jones fight can make money. That TV will be interested in Joe's farewell fight. That a faded name like Jones can still sell a fight - that he's "all the way back" (LOL) after beating Hanshaw and Tito. That HBO will help promote it. That if it's on Setanta, ppl will keep on subscribing for stuff like this.

yes, makes money, makes sense. Pavlik isn't the big time fighter just yet that he will become. So they go for Jones. I think everyone seems to understand this pretty clearly.

But Enzo is talking about deserving, about what fight is most significant to the present p4p line-up. He is talking some rubbish and ppl are objecting to it and rightly so. The Calzaghes have said that Pavlik doesn't want the fight - speaking for Pavlik when really they are turning him down - and now they have changed it to Pavlik doesn't deserve the fight. Joe and Enzo are not straight talking guys - maybe they will make good promoters.

Let them make their killing. Let them have an appalling fight and bow out looking crap. The word "legendary" will be thrown around a lot before the fight. It won't be afterward.

1) you ever heard of "rhetoric"?

2) "appalling fight"? that's got to be a joke.....
Khaosai-Galaxy
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 2739
Joined: 29 Apr 2007, 12:15

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Khaosai-Galaxy »

DavidPayne wrote:
He needed Hopkins and Glen Johnson and Clinton Woods - 3-4 years ago.
Johnson i can live with, but Clinton Woods?

No, sorry i can't let that one pass by.....
forcefraser
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 5446
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 06:15

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by forcefraser »

Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:God, what a bunch of effing whinging old women


Are some of you completely unable to see further than then end of your own nose?

So in Enzo's opinion Pavlik isnt as deserving as Roy Jones?

Well i agree, ask the paying public who they would rather see, Calzaghe vs Jones or Pavlik and 90% will go for the guy they have head of, Jones

Once again we get another pointless thread from some tiresome prole unable to understand the world away from internet forums
Utter shite. Why ask 90% of the paying public anything???? Why not ask boxing fans??? Ask any boxing fan worth his salt which fight they would rather see Calzaghe v Pavlik or Calzaghe v 40 year old Roy past his prime Jones. Only a fool would opt for the Jones fight.

Pavlik, Froch, Abraham and Bute would all be much tougher and more dangerous fights for Calzaghe than Jones.

Calzaghe is purely after a big pay day against a one time legend. He admits himself that it is about the money. I can tell you now that a Calzaghe v Jones fight would be a 12 round point affair with no one coming close to a knockout. I dont`t think any of the other 4 mentioned above would go the distance. Therein lies the difference.
Autobarn
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 16093
Joined: 05 Jul 2005, 13:01

Re: More Enzo Calzaghe bollocks (Pavlik/Calzaghe)

Post by Autobarn »

Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:
Autobarn wrote:
Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:God, what a bunch of effing whinging old women


Are some of you completely unable to see further than then end of your own nose?

So in Enzo's opinion Pavlik isnt as deserving as Roy Jones?

Well i agree, ask the paying public who they would rather see, Calzaghe vs Jones or Pavlik and 90% will go for the guy they have head of, Jones

Once again we get another pointless thread from some tiresome prole unable to understand the world away from internet forums
we all know that a Jones fight can make money. That TV will be interested in Joe's farewell fight. That a faded name like Jones can still sell a fight - that he's "all the way back" (LOL) after beating Hanshaw and Tito. That HBO will help promote it. That if it's on Setanta, ppl will keep on subscribing for stuff like this.

yes, makes money, makes sense. Pavlik isn't the big time fighter just yet that he will become. So they go for Jones. I think everyone seems to understand this pretty clearly.

But Enzo is talking about deserving, about what fight is most significant to the present p4p line-up. He is talking some rubbish and ppl are objecting to it and rightly so. The Calzaghes have said that Pavlik doesn't want the fight - speaking for Pavlik when really they are turning him down - and now they have changed it to Pavlik doesn't deserve the fight. Joe and Enzo are not straight talking guys - maybe they will make good promoters.

Let them make their killing. Let them have an appalling fight and bow out looking crap. The word "legendary" will be thrown around a lot before the fight. It won't be afterward.

1) you ever heard of "rhetoric"?

2) "appalling fight"? that's got to be a joke.....
yes, and the rhetoric is shameless. what do you want ppl to do, agree with that gibberish?

Or shall we take it as though we are "average fans"?

The fight will be shockingly bad.
Last edited by Autobarn on 26 Jun 2008, 06:18, edited 1 time in total.
Post Reply