I knew Hatton Would Split From Graham.

Dirk Kelly · Post by **Dirk Kelly** » 15 Dec 2007, 19:46

banjo wrote:
Dirk Kelly wrote:
Southpaw Stylist wrote:LOL, just found this cringeworthy video of Hatton being interviewed before he began training.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh3AizWGAX4
What boxing match was he commenting on for Sky? Can remember this but not who was fighting that night!
i think it was moore v facey

Spot on, thanks

Tunney · Post by **Tunney** » 16 Dec 2007, 02:04

I think Hatton should choose another trainer - someone like Enzo Calzaghe would be better. The fact that Graham is a heavy smoker says a lot about his understanding of health and fitness. Hatton needs live a healthier lifestyle if he has any hope of further success...

Sammy Mendelson · Post by **Sammy Mendelson** » 16 Dec 2007, 06:35

Tunney wrote:The fact that Graham is a heavy smoker says a lot about his understanding of health and fitness.

Tunney, that is perhaps the most woefully inaccurate statement I have read in my entire life.

It is plain wrong to argue against a person's knowledge on a particular subject based on the fact that they smoke. There is no scientifically proven connection between smoking and a lack of understanding of health and fitness. Your comment is as half-witted as stating the following:

The fact that Graham is a heavy smoker says a lot about his understanding of nuclear physics.

The fact that Graham is a heavy smoker says a lot about his understanding of military history.

WildWaylon · Post by **WildWaylon** » 16 Dec 2007, 07:16

banjo wrote:
Dirk Kelly wrote:
Southpaw Stylist wrote:LOL, just found this cringeworthy video of Hatton being interviewed before he began training.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh3AizWGAX4
What boxing match was he commenting on for Sky? Can remember this but not who was fighting that night!
i think it was moore v facey

Youre right it was - I said to my wife, Witter is there supporting Facey and Hatton is supporting Moore as well as working for Sky.

StepinFetchit · Post by **StepinFetchit** » 16 Dec 2007, 07:39

On a side note, did anyone notice how bad Hatton's dressing room looked before he came out for the fight....he had one guy that looked like he couldn't punch through a bag of chips cheering Hatton everytime he shadow boxed....Graham looked like he was sh!tting it aswell.

rhino222 · Post by **rhino222** » 16 Dec 2007, 08:10

Emerson Poncey Name Ghent wrote:
StepinFetchit wrote:
Emerson Poncey Name Ghent wrote: I disagree, Roach did wonders with Pacman (and Manfredo to a certain degree) transforming him from a brawler and Calzaghe's record speaks for itself.
I can't remember exactly when Roach took over pacman but i reccon Manny was still a young fighter and he had a lot more to work with stylisticly.

Hatton has gone too far down the road to change his style now.....Hatton never had great head movement anyway.

Hatton put too much into this exbodybuilder as a conditioner and hitting a static bodybag in place of quality sparring and working on new moves.

Hatton is done, someone stick a fork in him.
He was 26, only 3 years difference.

its not the age of the car its the miles on the clock mate... !!

lowersmiths · Post by **lowersmiths** » 16 Dec 2007, 08:28

hatton hasnt been in many hard fights, he was a massive favourite in most of his fights.

boxers like vargas, barrera and morales have real miles on the clock.

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 16 Dec 2007, 08:33

Nothing on any websites to suggest he has split from Graham...where's the sources for this?

Twinkle Toes · Post by **Twinkle Toes** » 16 Dec 2007, 08:56

There was some bits and bobs in the tabloids the last couple of days.

I certainly would lay some fault at Graham's door, he has maintained for as long as I remember that he knew the way to beat Mayweather.

It can be argued that Hatton took no notice of Billy, but if there is that much lack of respect there, then something isn't right.

I've touched on it before, but we have to question Hattons sparring for fights, all we ever see is him pounding a body bag, and in my view it is no coincidence that his ring smarts have suffered.

Graham is at fault as are other members of the team, including Hatton himself.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 16 Dec 2007, 09:00

I already said why Ricky's declined. Let me sum it up:

1) After beating Tzsyu, they thought they could beat everyone with that maul 'em brawl 'em style. In other words, they believed the hype that idiots at Sky were saying, and the general boxing fanbase.

2) The level of opponent has improved, or is more hungry than Tzsyu at least. Tzsyu had been inactive for a year and was an old man. He had lost some hunger for the sport.

banjo · Post by **banjo** » 16 Dec 2007, 09:04

i agree about hattons quality of sparring apparently he sparred with 2 novices for the mayweather fight. i would have thought sparring with someone like mosley would be better preparation

Tunney · Post by **Tunney** » 16 Dec 2007, 12:15

Sammy Mendelson wrote:It is plain wrong to argue against a person's knowledge on a particular subject based on the fact that they smoke. There is no scientifically proven connection between smoking and a lack of understanding of health and fitness. Your comment is as half-witted as stating the following:

The fact that Graham is a heavy smoker says a lot about his understanding of nuclear physics.

The fact that Graham is a heavy smoker says a lot about his understanding of military history.

No, there is no connection between heavy smoking and nuclear physics or military history, but if a man is a heavy smoker it DOES tell us one of two things: either he doesn't understand that smoking has a negative effect on someone's health and fitness, or at least that he places little value on health and fitness. Most people know heavy smoking isn't good for one's health - only a few people would fail to make that connection, and I'm surprised you didn't, Sammy!

I imagine if a person understands that heavy smoking is bad for his health, then he wouldn't do it, unless he just doesn't care about his own health. Doesn't that make sense?

Tunney · Post by **Tunney** » 16 Dec 2007, 12:27

Terry D wrote:Many fighters and footballers smoked in the older days and were arguably tougher than the salad eating fags you get pancing about in the modern era.

Teddy Sheringham smoked also and he did Ok for himself.

Years ago, tobacco growers didn't use pesticides on the tobacco plants like they do now. I believe it's those chemicals more than the tobacco that cause smokers to develop health problems.

Poncey · Post by **Poncey** » 16 Dec 2007, 12:39

Terry D wrote:
Tunney wrote:
Terry D wrote:Many fighters and footballers smoked in the older days and were arguably tougher than the salad eating fags you get pancing about in the modern era.

Teddy Sheringham smoked also and he did Ok for himself.
Years ago, tobacco growers didn't use pesticides on the tobacco plants like they do now. I believe it's those chemicals more than the tobacco that cause smokers to develop health problems.
These guys drank also. Lippi smokes cigars whilst watching his team play but people don't run onto the pitch demanding he put his cigar away. Same for Vialli in his coaching days.

Whoever made the original point that Graham should be sacked for smoking is talking nonsense. People lauded Hatton's fitness after the Tszyu win and guess what? Graham was a smoker then. It is ludicrous.

If they want to look for a person to blame then how about the people who booked the guy in for numerous speaking engagements, late nights and, brace yourself, full of smoke and beer, prior to the biggest fight of his life.

Blame the fact that the guy used to spend his post-fight cup of tea talking to his trainer, who is knowledgable about the sport, but now spends his post-fight cup of tea fielding interviews, often over-booked at that, and signing stuff.

Blame the person who stacks his social diary until it is bulging without giving a thought as to how these things impact on his mental focus.

Blaming Graham is a knee-jerk reaction. Other names immediately spring to mind. It is bollocks and blame displacement.

Appreciate you're gonna speak from the heart here Terry, but I think Hatton needs a change.

Graham is in the second tier of quality trainers, but I think he needs Calzaghe or Roach to try and change things (even slightly) to change his game.

The blame has to lie at Hatton's feet, as he said on the after fight interview on HBO, but maybe a change in trainer will make him listen more. Bit like the Taylor/Steward situation.

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:18

So is this

a) Just Hatton in denial

b) A lack of professionalism in the build up from Graham

c) A disagreement about the future, Hatton wants money at 147, Graham wants easier money and optimum performance at 140

Retrospect is easy of course, but for all the facts that NDou and Baldomir dont equate to Ricky, their quality compared to Mayfield et al at the Phoenix is clear too.

And equally, the focus on stamina and strength over timing and form is too acute to.

However, I would hate to see Ricky cash his chips in versus DLH rather than regroup properly. DLH would be massive physically for Hatton.

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:38

All she wrote

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PFcVYXvKoU

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:42

He'll fight on with Billy Graham and no idea where the rumours came from. He didn't flinch when asked the question.

dbf · Post by **dbf** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:49

If only Ricky lived in the states as Joe Goosen would do well with him.

He would get Rickys jab back, ala Corrales, and rebuild him after a comprehensive loss, ala Mosely after his first defeat to Wright.

Ricky's training has been focused mainly on conditioning, stength and losing weight more than skill and tactics. There were signs of this since Maussa, but it never so clearly as in his defeat to Mayweather

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:51

The parallels with Hamed are there. They're different flavours of a similar drink.

TerribleTerry · Post by **TerribleTerry** » 17 Dec 2007, 08:02

Terry D wrote:Many fighters and footballers smoked in the older days and were arguably tougher than the salad eating fags you get pancing about in the modern era.

Teddy Sheringham smoked also and he did Ok for himself.

Carlos Monzon was reportedly a 40 a day man during his championship days, although with his engine I can't see that myself.

His compatriot and fellow all time great Nicolino Locche was also partial to the tabs.

The great Aussie Lionel Rose was a pipe smoker if I remember correctly and guys like Mickey Walker and Rocky Graziano were party animals and consequently, smokers.

More recently Manuel Medina only cut out the smokes whilst in training camp for a fight - the rest of the time he was lit up like a chimney. Same goes for that good looking chap Daniel Zaragoza.

Graham's habit doesnt mean he cant train fighters or pass on his knowledge. Len Woodhall was a big smoker yet he managed to produce a WBC world champ in his son Richie. Not bad eh?

punchers chance · Post by **punchers chance** » 17 Dec 2007, 08:55

In today's Manchester Evening News Ray Hatton says that these rumours about ditching Billy Graham are a load of garbage.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 17 Dec 2007, 11:28

I am not a particular Hatton fan, but he is a class guy.

So is Mayweather, funnily enough. Contrary to what people see and hear on TV.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 17 Dec 2007, 20:17

So just to clarify - at this point in time this thread is a load of bollocks.

Dirk Kelly · Post by **Dirk Kelly** » 18 Dec 2007, 08:02

TerribleTerry wrote:
Terry D wrote:Many fighters and footballers smoked in the older days and were arguably tougher than the salad eating fags you get pancing about in the modern era.

Teddy Sheringham smoked also and he did Ok for himself.
Carlos Monzon was reportedly a 40 a day man during his championship days, although with his engine I can't see that myself.

His compatriot and fellow all time great Nicolino Locche was also partial to the tabs.

The great Aussie Lionel Rose was a pipe smoker if I remember correctly and guys like Mickey Walker and Rocky Graziano were party animals and consequently, smokers.

More recently Manuel Medina only cut out the smokes whilst in training camp for a fight - the rest of the time he was lit up like a chimney. Same goes for that good looking chap Daniel Zaragoza.

Graham's habit doesnt mean he cant train fighters or pass on his knowledge. Len Woodhall was a big smoker yet he managed to produce a WBC world champ in his son Richie. Not bad eh?

Was the Olympic Champion, Jesse Owens a pack a day smoker??

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 18 Dec 2007, 08:04

Wasn't everyone in 1936?