Bellew performance

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 17 Jul 2011, 08:08

TheCobra wrote:
stujones wrote:
TheCobra wrote:Yeh Jim Watt's negativity certainly didn't help things. The commentary (not the fight) reminded me of Froch vs Johnson, where Watt was so negative it spoiled it. But any way you look at it, this was not a masterclass, just a safe as houses points win without dominating the opponent. Positives and negatives to it.
How can you not be negative about the fight..... it was a massive dissapointment and Jim's criticisms was labelled firmly with Ovil.

Jim's criticisms of Bellew was in the analysis that this is a "shop window" for a world title fight with Cleverly at Ringside.... do fans want to see the fight now? I would agree with Watt, not immediately, Tony is not ready for it and this fight didn't win over new fans in terms of excitement.

He did frequently point out the positives in that he is doing enough, McKenzie is dangerous but Bellew is boxing safe and controlled.
It's ok being negative, but to repeat the same things over and over for 12 rounds really drained me!

It was a repetitive fight though - if Jim didn't repeat it would have been like a silent movie.

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 17 Jul 2011, 08:17

It wasn't an exciting performance, but a win is a win, and the lad now has the Lonsdale belt.
There is still work to be done, i'm not keen on Tony's defence when someone is attacking him, it seems to be disorganised. And although he moved well for 12 rounds, i feel he needed to set his feet more in each round to land better punches , then get back to the moving. Late on in the fight he did seem to sting Ovil when he did this, but not enough.

A defence against Macintosh, Ajisafe or Jeffries would make sense, and be good fights.

Final round · Post by **Final round** » 17 Jul 2011, 09:06

He should have come on stronger when he had the rounds under his belt or at least had a go and see what came back.

Realistic · Post by **Realistic** » 17 Jul 2011, 09:11

Cardiff-Lad1 wrote:Cant understand why people think he should fight Cleverly next because 'theres no one else in Britain left'..... Boxing happens outside of the UK.

Boxing Cleverly means he's getting a World title fight FFS. what has he done to deserve that?? if they weren't domestic rivals it wouldnt even be thought of. Bellew is scraping by at British level. He looked shite last night again what is only a decent journeyman. Ovill now has 11 losses on his record!!! Hardly preparation for a World title fight.

IMO Bellew needs to move up slowly and at least go to a decent European level before being allowed a world title shot. if he does get it now then its ridiculous in my opinion.

It is called jumping on the band wagon, I honestly think that Tony is pushing for the Cleverly fight because it is only a matter of time before he is found out, the first top 10 fighter he is in with will beat him, then he looses quarter of a million pound pay day

Lets be honest who would not want the fight for that money. The downside of this is that he jumps a que of fighters who have earned a title fight by their quality and not by the amount of insults one can throw.

charlieb · Post by **charlieb** » 17 Jul 2011, 09:27

I had it a close fight, but it's in the bag now and McKenzie get's to be someone else's pain in the arse.

Horse · Post by **Horse** » 17 Jul 2011, 10:09

Realistic wrote:It is called jumping on the band wagon, I honestly think that Tony is pushing for the Cleverly fight because it is only a matter of time before he is found out, the first top 10 fighter he is in with will beat him, then he looses quarter of a million pound pay day Lets be honest who would not want the fight for that money.

Would Bellew make £250,000 for a fight with Cleverly? Yesterday's performance has got to have killed a fair amount of the hype for the fight.

whiskey · Post by **whiskey** » 17 Jul 2011, 10:15

Tony,

Seems like there's a few fans and a few haters on this thread. I'm neither mate, but admire you calling the names out and demanding the big fights, which is always something I respect. Here's my take on it.

You'll always put food on the table fighting in that manner.

But unless you want your kids to eat beans on toast every night for the rest of their lives, you'd better box a bit venomous and with more spirit than that next time out. You missed a real "shop window" opportunity to gain interest and momentum last night. Which is far more important than a title when it comes to earning money.

I've seen Hatton and Froch on undercards in their home towns after selling lots of tickets and when they came into the ring, by god they delivered. That's where they cut their teeth and got noticed for all the right reasons.

Ovill is a journeyman whichever way you cut it and I thought you'd have tried to gun him down after the 5th round once his initial storm had passed. It's not like he was running and being negative. You could have made target practice of him late on.

Nobody wants you to be reckless and lose, we just got very bored by what seemed liked a tedious coasting exercise behind the jab.

Positives: worked to a plan, footwork and jab were effective at this level. Still pretty afterwards.
Negatives: paint drying springs to mind. McGuigan's forecast was very wide of the mark.

In closing, the only way I could understand you fighting in that manner, was to avoid cuts/injuries for a possible showdown with Clev in September.... am I right or can't you say anything ?

Coco · Post by **Coco** » 17 Jul 2011, 10:26

The most important thing for Bellew is to keep winning which he did last night and he did it well, credit has to be given to his new training team too.
He has previously shown he is an exciting fighter and it is very harsh to criticise him for being sensible and highlighting his boxing skills last night.
If he is going to step up a level he will need to utilise all facets of his talent.
He could on the other hand opt to be a face first slugger 100% of the time, ask John Murray how that works for him at European level

Horse · Post by **Horse** » 17 Jul 2011, 10:49

Coco wrote:He has previously shown he is an exciting fighter and it is very harsh to criticise him for being sensible and highlighting his boxing skills last night.

It is not very harsh at all. He was fighting an average domestic level fighter and he treated him like a dangerous world class puncher. He was far too negative considering his opposition.

Coco wrote:If he is going to step up a level he will need to utilise all facets of his talent.
He could on the other hand opt to be a face first slugger 100% of the time, ask John Murray how that works for him at European level

It is not a choice between doing what he did in the first fight and what he did in the second. He should have found a much better balance.

Big_Amzzino · Post by **Big_Amzzino** » 17 Jul 2011, 10:53

He boxed safely knowing a win would set up a big money fight with Cleverly in the fall. Can't hate on the guy for fighting cautiously.

Calling it a masterclass was a bit over the top tough.

Realistic · Post by **Realistic** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:02

Big_Amzzino wrote:He boxed safely knowing a win would set up a big money fight with Cleverly in the fall. Can't hate on the guy for fighting cautiously.

Calling it a masterclass was a bit over the top tough.

I don't think the Cleverly fight will happen after that performance, he should be made to fight a top 10 ranking and then if he comes through it maybe....

Coco · Post by **Coco** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:03

Horse wrote:
Coco wrote:He has previously shown he is an exciting fighter and it is very harsh to criticise him for being sensible and highlighting his boxing skills last night.
It is not very harsh at all. He was fighting an average domestic level fighter and he treated him like a dangerous world class puncher. He was far too negative considering his opposition.

Ovil showed he could hurt Bellew and knock him out. When you are fighting someone like that you have to change tactics. The Jamaician is clearly not world class but there is not much between him and the Scouser if they stand in front of each other.
Bellew has a big payday and opportunity in front of him and it would be silly to risk it.

Big_Amzzino · Post by **Big_Amzzino** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:04

Realistic wrote:
Big_Amzzino wrote:He boxed safely knowing a win would set up a big money fight with Cleverly in the fall. Can't hate on the guy for fighting cautiously.

Calling it a masterclass was a bit over the top tough.
I don't think the Cleverly fight will happen after that performance, he should be made to fight a top 10 ranking and then if he comes through it maybe....

Both are allegedly fighters and it is a grudge match. The fight will happen.

Realistic · Post by **Realistic** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:06

Horse wrote:
Realistic wrote:It is called jumping on the band wagon, I honestly think that Tony is pushing for the Cleverly fight because it is only a matter of time before he is found out, the first top 10 fighter he is in with will beat him, then he looses quarter of a million pound pay day Lets be honest who would not want the fight for that money.
Would Bellew make £250,000 for a fight with Cleverly? Yesterday's performance has got to have killed a fair amount of the hype for the fight.

I believe that was a figure branded around when he came in last time, after last night knock a few zeros off

That said he does has a lot of fans who think he is ready and will pay the money, you only have to look on here to see the "Smoke Blowing" brigade who think he is the best LH in the World never mind the UK

Realistic · Post by **Realistic** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:08

Big_Amzzino wrote:
Realistic wrote:
Big_Amzzino wrote:He boxed safely knowing a win would set up a big money fight with Cleverly in the fall. Can't hate on the guy for fighting cautiously.

Calling it a masterclass was a bit over the top tough.
I don't think the Cleverly fight will happen after that performance, he should be made to fight a top 10 ranking and then if he comes through it maybe....
Both are allegedly fighters and it is a grudge match. The fight will happen.

I hope it does as it will be an easy first defence, that said I hope he only gets paid what he is worth and not 250k

leforge · Post by **leforge** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:10

Surely he can't fight for World title after that performance.

Big_Amzzino · Post by **Big_Amzzino** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:11

Realistic wrote:
Big_Amzzino wrote:
Realistic wrote: I don't think the Cleverly fight will happen after that performance, he should be made to fight a top 10 ranking and then if he comes through it maybe....
Both are allegedly fighters and it is a grudge match. The fight will happen.
I hope it does as it will be an easy first defence, that said I hope he only gets paid what he is worth and not 250k

Cleverly is the most protected fighter in boxing today. I was at the o2 for his last fight and i was not impressed. I know it was a last minute replacement but he looked far too easy to hit. He even got rocked at one point.

Not saying Bellew would beat him but Clev will know he has been in a scrap that's for sure.

Big_Amzzino · Post by **Big_Amzzino** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:12

leforge wrote:Surely he can't fight for World title after that performance.

*paper World title.

Horse · Post by **Horse** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:17

Coco wrote:Ovil showed he could hurt Bellew and knock him out. When you are fighting someone like that you have to change tactics. The Jamaician is clearly not world class but there is not much between him and the Scouser if they stand in front of each other.
Bellew has a big payday and opportunity in front of him and it would be silly to risk it.

If he considers throwing a few power punches at McKenzie every round to be too much of a risk, then it doesn't say much for his self belief.

Coco · Post by **Coco** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:21

Horse wrote:
Coco wrote:Ovil showed he could hurt Bellew and knock him out. When you are fighting someone like that you have to change tactics. The Jamaician is clearly not world class but there is not much between him and the Scouser if they stand in front of each other.
Bellew has a big payday and opportunity in front of him and it would be silly to risk it.
If he considers throwing a few power punches at McKenzie every round to be too much of a risk, then it doesn't say much for his self belief.

I think domestic title standard is his level and he needs to box within those limitations

hurlock · Post by **hurlock** » 17 Jul 2011, 11:24

bellew is a roaro in term's of pro boxing & is moving pretty quickly in this fight he gained not the fan's. he got 12rds under his belt he was unscathed, he never got punished for his mistakes which he can now rectify when he watches it on tape.

jim watt makes very valid points but winges on them & has to realise his not in the corner but commentating. the guy is a great observer but once he has a bee in his bonnet & dont like what he's seeing he becomes hard work.

i personally felt bellew expended to much energy flying around & needs to use waist movement & start doubling his jab up,his shown a good tight guard & i think if he concentrates on certain aspects of his game, he can go very far.

bellew on starts to excite once his hurt, when he's eyes get glazed over & he stops thinking & goes arturo gatti on people's ar$es

D

well done fat joe

Final round · Post by **Final round** » 17 Jul 2011, 12:05

McIntosh would be a good test next.

SAPFO · Post by **SAPFO** » 17 Jul 2011, 12:40

Ovil McKenzie

Thanks for the support from everyone, last night didint go as I had planned it to be, i went to fight ,but Bellew came with a plan and out boxed me, he boxed and moved all the time, never gave me enough chances to get close to him and when i did get close he held me all the time, but you kno what i'll live to fight another day

Big_Amzzino · Post by **Big_Amzzino** » 17 Jul 2011, 12:53

hurlock wrote:bellew is a roaro in term's of pro boxing & is moving pretty quickly in this fight he gained not the fan's. he got 12rds under his belt he was unscathed, he never got punished for his mistakes which he can now rectify when he watches it on tape.

jim watt makes very valid points but winges on them & has to realise his not in the corner but commentating. the guy is a great observer but once he has a bee in his bonnet & dont like what he's seeing he becomes hard work.

i personally felt bellew expended to much energy flying around & needs to use waist movement & start doubling his jab up,his shown a good tight guard & i think if he concentrates on certain aspects of his game, he can go very far.

bellew on starts to excite once his hurt, when he's eyes get glazed over & he stops thinking & goes arturo gatti on people's ar$es D

well done fat joe

You didn't reply to my private message :)

Big_Amzzino · Post by **Big_Amzzino** » 17 Jul 2011, 12:59

Cardiff-Lad1 wrote:
Big_Amzzino wrote:
Realistic wrote: I hope it does as it will be an easy first defence, that said I hope he only gets paid what he is worth and not 250k
Cleverly is the most protected fighter in boxing today. I was at the o2 for his last fight and i was not impressed. I know it was a last minute replacement but he looked far too easy to hit. He even got rocked at one point.

Not saying Bellew would beat him but Clev will know he has been in a scrap that's for sure.
most protected fighter in boxing today? What a load of Tosh!

Are you basing this on him fighting late replacements and not looking too good in his last 2 fights?

He's been in with undefeated fighters a few times and the likes of Murat have done more in his career than Bellew can most probably achieve!

If he was protected he'd be taking safe fights in Wales every few months but when was the last time he fought at 'home'?

If you want a protected fighter then look no further than Bellew. All his 'big' fighters have been in his home city against guys that he shouldve dispatched with out any issue as they were touching British level. McKenzie is a journeying, nothing more so i dunno why everyone is suddenly stating Tony should get this much touted world title shot after last nights performance, which was boring and lack lustre and that's being kind. being kind.

He is a British fighter fighting in Britain so technically he is fighting at home. Although it may not be his fault fact still remains that he was more or less given that paper World title.

Murat is a Euro level fighter at best and if that's the best name you can pull from his resume then that says it all really.

People want to see Cleverly vs Bellew because there is nothing the British fans like more than a grudge match. I was just as excited for this fight when it was originally meant to take place in May then i was for DeGale vs Groves.

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