Doncaster Legend

[jonny]

Could have been, yes.

Another hard man of the town

[mickey1975]

My uncle's next door neighbour (who was actually the Hovis bread boy in the commercials) was due to fight Gorman and Gaskin at the same time on the edge of a cliff just outside a traveller site but they turned up mob handed daint they so what he did was sawed his own leg off and beat half the mob to death with the soggy end and the rest just done one as they just bricked it. True story as I heard it off a bloke in a pub somewhere.

Why doesn't your uncle have a word with him, see if he wants to write a book?

[DavidPayne]

Could have been, yes.

Another hard man of the town

Tells another story of a fella called Johnny Church who believed he was getting the better of Danny when assailed by 'friends'.

Again, not witnessed, just retold.

[The Insider]

My uncle's next door neighbour (who was actually the Hovis bread boy in the commercials) was due to that onet Gorman and Gaskin at the same time on the edge of a cliff just outside a traveller site but they turned up mob handed daint they so what he did was sawed his own leg off and beat half the mob to death with the soggy end and the rest just done one as they just bricked it. True story as I heard it off a bloke in a pub somewhere.

Why doesn't your uncle have a word with him, see if he wants to write a book?

He couldn't mate he sawed his hands off and threw them at Lenny McLean and Roy Shaw when he was due to take them on at the same.time. He won that scrap though by a series of devastating headbutts.

[DavidPayne]

My uncle's next door neighbour (who was actually the Hovis bread boy in the commercials) was due to that onet Gorman and Gaskin at the same time on the edge of a cliff just outside a traveller site but they turned up mob handed daint they so what he did was sawed his own leg off and beat half the mob to death with the soggy end and the rest just done one as they just bricked it. True story as I heard it off a bloke in a pub somewhere.

Why doesn't your uncle have a word with him, see if he wants to write a book?

He couldn't mate he sawed his hands off and threw them at Lenny McLean and Roy Shaw when he was due to take them on at the same.time. He won that scrap though by a series of devastating headbutts.

Black knight humour. Love it.

Its just a flesh wound.

[palooka]

Shaw was a serious guy, but even by his own admission not the best BKB guy. I just wanted to know if that day was really known as the st ledger massacre. I'm satisfied that only Bartleys folk call it that.

People get bad beatings all the time, there's nothing really interesting or tragic about this case. Bartley showed up for a fight, started shouting and swearing at everybody, got done in badly and then dramatised it for his book.

If it happened to you, or to anyone, am sure you'd call it a massacre too.

As for Gorman, nah, he didn't. Gaskin started the trouble when he beat the eff out of Bartley's brother John. That's when Bartley and Sam went down to Doncaster to meet Gaskin and Danny Shenton (who was to fight Sam), and of course Gaskin had group of men with him. Gorman dropped Gaskin, then all hell broke loose, and Shenton left because he wanted no part of the mayhem, for he came only to have a fair fight. And of course, after Sam and Bartley were beaten to a pulp, Gaskin tried to cut his leg off.

Ask Bob Gaskin sometime why he stopped actively fighting after that. I'll tell you why, cus the prick was an asshole and thought he could do whatever the eff he wanted and he got shot right through the guts. So, before you take someone's word on anything--- let's look at the source. Gaskin was a bad man, just like Paul Sykes was a bad man. Mean to the core, and he eventually got his.

And again... rather than hem haw about this, why not help and look for newspaper archives from that particular week and see what the press said. I happen to believe Gorman's end of it was far more truthful than anything else.


Btw... anyone ever been to the Grapes in Appleby? There's wood carved monument of Gorman's famed fight with Rooney there. Anyone has any pictures of it, would be much appreciated to get a look see.

In the book it mentions that a famous old gypsy man had been robbed of a lot of money (about £20,000 from memory and in 1976 that was a hell of a lot of money) and had put Gorman in the frame - he had put Gaskin onto Bartley. I've not met many travellers who are soft at their core; you are calling Gaskin a bad man on the basis of a chapter in a book. You haven't put forward any other persons view that backs up Gormans claim - indeed if the attack was so serious how weren't there any arrests? I spoke to Gaskin and he didn't say anything bad about Gorman whatsoever - he just said it was exaggerated for the book. It happens you know.

I'll try and have a look through the Doncaster Star archive from that year; I'm in town every day and I know the central library had them on microfiche at one time.

[palooka]

I mentioned to my Dad this thread, specifically Danny Shenton who I'd said my Dad sort of knew. Well, he knew him a bit more than that. Danny was two years older than my Dad and grew up across the street in Cantley. Once locked my Dad in the coal-shed!

And he tells another tale of him walking from town having been beat up by three, when my Grandma and Grandad picked him up in their car, he refused to get in at first, but succumbed and they cleaned him up before he went home.

He said he'd see the three "one at a time".

Another fella lived around the other corner, used to knockabout with Danny, want to say Tommy something or other, forget.

He didn't remember the St Leger story specifically.

Shenton weren't a cuddly man; he ran protection rackets in town and was named in a book by Balby, Doncaster armed robber Frank Cook. He had a gang and they kidnapped a business man and cut either his finger or his ear off for a ransom; I think that's what he was in Armley for.

I met his daughter (Bonnie) a few times when we used to go into town; she was alright but no one would go with her in case her dad got wind of it.

(When Gorman went to fight Blond Simey he was set upon by 2 dogs, he fought them off and when Blond Simey wasn't there he overturned a car in anger! - google bartley gorman - it's on the dragon 1010 board.)

[palooka]

what a load of macho bollocks.

I bet half these fights and 'stories' are like playground Chinese whispers.

Im affraid not matey, I wish it was when i got kicked in and pissed on as a kid. My dad got into some threats when a mate was burgeled and we had to move away from Edlo so thats telling you something for a family to do that.

Tell me who pissed on you and I'll find out how they're doing for you.

[Mimmy]

what a load of macho bollocks.

I bet half these fights and 'stories' are like playground Chinese whispers.

Im affraid not matey, I wish it was when i got kicked in and pissed on as a kid. My dad got into some threats when a mate was burgeled and we had to move away from Edlo so thats telling you something for a family to do that.

Tell me who pissed on you and I'll find out how they're doing for you.

Palooka its a part of my childhood Id rather forget, there were some mean kids in Edlo in the late 70's. some bastards just wanted to punch other kids for fcuk all. Im sure if I searched facebook Id find the person(s) who were total wankers!

[mickey1975]

what a load of macho bollocks.

I bet half these fights and 'stories' are like playground Chinese whispers.

Im affraid not matey, I wish it was when i got kicked in and pissed on as a kid. My dad got into some threats when a mate was burgeled and we had to move away from Edlo so thats telling you something for a family to do that.

Tell me who pissed on you and I'll find out how they're doing for you.

I proper lol'd at that Palooka!

[Teddy's Toupee]

I mentioned to my Dad this thread, specifically Danny Shenton who I'd said my Dad sort of knew. Well, he knew him a bit more than that. Danny was two years older than my Dad and grew up across the street in Cantley. Once locked my Dad in the coal-shed!

And he tells another tale of him walking from town having been beat up by three, when my Grandma and Grandad picked him up in their car, he refused to get in at first, but succumbed and they cleaned him up before he went home.

He said he'd see the three "one at a time".

Another fella lived around the other corner, used to knockabout with Danny, want to say Tommy something or other, forget.

He didn't remember the St Leger story specifically.

Shenton weren't a cuddly man; he ran protection rackets in town and was named in a book by Balby, Doncaster armed robber Frank Cook. He had a gang and they kidnapped a business man and cut either his finger or his ear off for a ransom; I think that's what he was in Armley for.

I met his daughter (Bonnie) a few times when we used to go into town; she was alright but no one would go with her in case her dad got wind of it.

(When Gorman went to fight Blond Simey he was set upon by 2 dogs, he fought them off and when Blond Simey wasn't there he overturned a car in anger! - google bartley gorman - it's on the dragon 1010 board.)

I know someone from Doncaster who overturned a car park in anger when a customer on their window-cleaning round gave them a 20p tip.

[HomicideHenry]

I'll try and have a look through the Doncaster Star archive from that year; I'm in town every day and I know the central library had them on microfiche at one time.

You do that. I myself am looking into archives in the Daily Mirror, Irish Press, Birmingham Post, and other syndicates because I am trying to arrange a scrap book on the life and times of some of England and Ireland's famed traveller fighters--- Gorman, of course being the most noted and well known. SO far, I found an article in the Daily Mirror of him challenging Roy Shaw and Shaw replying he would fight Gorman (never took off), and also found in the Irish Press archives a challenge issued to Dan Rooney allegedly from Gorman (I assume this was the challenge Gorman's cousin Peter Maguire sent through the Irish Press syndicate without Gorman's knowledge, and unfortunately set up the 'title' brawl at Sam Gorman's wake).

[hurlock]

Not a fan of this bkb the fights seem to stop once both exhausted & they persist to row after!! They should count them when they go down I think.
Some of them look like they shape up really bad but you forget how teak tough some of these fighters are the Irish travellers can really soak it up & bred like fighting dogs from young.do they earn money or is it the betting that creates the money??

[Teddy's Toupee]

what a load of macho bollocks.

I bet half these fights and 'stories' are like playground Chinese whispers.

Im affraid not matey, I wish it was when i got kicked in and pissed on as a kid. My dad got into some threats when a mate was burgeled and we had to move away from Edlo so thats telling you something for a family to do that.

Tell me who pissed on you and I'll find out how they're doing for you.

Was it a certain Mr. Fox, mimmy123?

[HomicideHenry]

Not a fan of this bkb the fights seem to stop once both exhausted & they persist to row after!! They should count them when they go down I think.
Some of them look like they shape up really bad but you forget how teak tough some of these fighters are the Irish travellers can really soak it up & bred like fighting dogs from young.do they earn money or is it the betting that creates the money??

Each man puts up a mutually agreed to side bet; as far as the traveller bkb matches are concerned. Winner take all propositions, unless both sides agree to a draw and the fight cannot continue anymore.

[palooka]

I'll try and have a look through the Doncaster Star archive from that year; I'm in town every day and I know the central library had them on microfiche at one time.

You do that. I myself am looking into archives in the Daily Mirror, Irish Press, Birmingham Post, and other syndicates because I am trying to arrange a scrap book on the life and times of some of England and Ireland's famed traveller fighters--- Gorman, of course being the most noted and well known. SO far, I found an article in the Daily Mirror of him challenging Roy Shaw and Shaw replying he would fight Gorman (never took off), and also found in the Irish Press archives a challenge issued to Dan Rooney allegedly from Gorman (I assume this was the challenge Gorman's cousin Peter Maguire sent through the Irish Press syndicate without Gorman's knowledge, and unfortunately set up the 'title' brawl at Sam Gorman's wake).

You'll do well to get a rounded view of that scene; a lot of what has been in the mainstream newspapers is sensational and generally puts the side across given by the most media savvy. There is a lot of factionalism as well because many of the fighters belong to large or extended families a beaten fighter will often offer more than one excuse for a loss and will be very reluctant to accept that they've been beaten fair. Some of the more fierce fighters have a reputation outside of the law as well and don't take well to interviewers or outsiders peeking in to their business.

It looks from a few of your posts that you are a Bartley Gorman fan and that is fine and his story has been told; there are plenty of good fighters around now who have a good and in some cases inspiring story to tell; mickey1975 knows lots more than me and THEGOODS knows a few people as well.

[palooka]

That must be Edlington Pit; you'd not recognise the place now - there's been a housing estate on there 20 years.

[Mimmy]

That must be Edlington Pit; you'd not recognise the place now - there's been a housing estate on there 20 years.

You are right Palooka and Its funny as one of the district nurses i met a while ago who had a pit stop (pardon the pun) at our hospital used to live on the site of the old pit, she informed me that there was evidence of subsidence on some houses there now.

[palooka]

That must be Edlington Pit; you'd not recognise the place now - there's been a housing estate on there 20 years.

You are right Palooka and Its funny as one of the district nurses i met a while ago who had a pit stop (pardon the pun) at our hospital used to live on the site of the old pit, she informed me that there was evidence of subsidence on some houses there now.

Same at Armthorpe.

[Mukel]

FAO Palooka

Here is an image thats long gone, surely this is in the category Donny legend

click pic to enlarge

Is that the old pit in Edlington?

[Teddy's Toupee]

FAO Palooka

Here is an image thats long gone, surely this is in the category Donny legend

click pic to enlarge

Is that the old pit in Edlington?

I wonder who that car and trailer belonged to?

[Tomasino]

FAO Palooka

Here is an image thats long gone, surely this is in the category Donny legend

click pic to enlarge

Is that the old pit in Edlington?

I wonder who that car and trailer belonged to?

Jimmy Saville.

[Teddy's Toupee]

Clunk click every trip.

[bluethedog]

Shaw was a serious guy, but even by his own admission not the best BKB guy. I just wanted to know if that day was really known as the st ledger massacre. I'm satisfied that only Bartleys folk call it that.

People get bad beatings all the time, there's nothing really interesting or tragic about this case. Bartley showed up for a fight, started shouting and swearing at everybody, got done in badly and then dramatised it for his book.

If it happened to you, or to anyone, am sure you'd call it a massacre too.

As for Gorman, nah, he didn't. Gaskin started the trouble when he beat the eff out of Bartley's brother John. That's when Bartley and Sam went down to Doncaster to meet Gaskin and Danny Shenton (who was to fight Sam), and of course Gaskin had group of men with him. Gorman dropped Gaskin, then all hell broke loose, and Shenton left because he wanted no part of the mayhem, for he came only to have a fair fight. And of course, after Sam and Bartley were beaten to a pulp, Gaskin tried to cut his leg off.

Ask Bob Gaskin sometime why he stopped actively fighting after that. I'll tell you why, cus the prick was an asshole and thought he could do whatever the eff he wanted and he got shot right through the guts. So, before you take someone's word on anything--- let's look at the source. Gaskin was a bad man, just like Paul Sykes was a bad man. Mean to the core, and he eventually got his.

And again... rather than hem haw about this, why not help and look for newspaper archives from that particular week and see what the press said. I happen to believe Gorman's end of it was far more truthful than anything else.


Btw... anyone ever been to the Grapes in Appleby? There's wood carved monument of Gorman's famed fight with Rooney there. Anyone has any pictures of it, would be much appreciated to get a look see.

In the book it mentions that a famous old gypsy man had been robbed of a lot of money (about £20,000 from memory and in 1976 that was a hell of a lot of money) and had put Gorman in the frame - he had put Gaskin onto Bartley. I've not met many travellers who are soft at their core; you are calling Gaskin a bad man on the basis of a chapter in a book. You haven't put forward any other persons view that backs up Gormans claim - indeed if the attack was so serious how weren't there any arrests? I spoke to Gaskin and he didn't say anything bad about Gorman whatsoever - he just said it was exaggerated for the book. It happens you know.

I'll try and have a look through the Doncaster Star archive from that year; I'm in town every day and I know the central library had them on microfiche at one time.

I was there on that Saturady, Gorman never threw a punch he did not get chance, he was ambushed, Danny tried to break it up. basicly because he knew the repercussions I have read various versions of this event and non are what I actually witnessed. I dropped Danny at the Hospital next day he went to make peace with Gorman and I belive he did.

[brilo33]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQYbpk0IL7k saw a video on bartley recently, no footage of him fighting though , i know furys are related , also young boxer Charles Frankham