Destroy Your Idols.

[Kalan]

Do you think Zamora had a chance against Pedroza at featherweight?

I don't know, but Zamora never got to Featherweight... His career was done when he was 26 cuz Zarate destroyed him... His chin was history after that.

By the time the great Eusebio Pedroza got to featherweight, he was stronger and was getting better and better. The bantamweight division proved that he was not in the right weight class for his height. I don't think Alfonso Zamora would have beat him at featherweight.

If he doesn't run into Zarate first...he destroys Pedroza at ANY weight...

[elmersalsa]

I don't know, but Zamora never got to Featherweight... His career was done when he was 26 cuz Zarate destroyed him... His chin was history after that.

By the time the great Eusebio Pedroza got to featherweight, he was stronger and was getting better and better. The bantamweight division proved that he was not in the right weight class for his height. I don't think Alfonso Zamora would have beat him at featherweight.

If he doesn't run into Zarate first...he destroys Pedroza at ANY weight...

GTFOH!

[Kalan]

YOU GTFOOH... Before he met the extremely great and formidable Zarate -- Zamora crushed Pedroza like he was Floyd Mayweather's girl friend.

[elmersalsa]

Pedroza was an inexperienced fighter, then. The WEIGHT proved that he was too frail for 118lbs.

What happened when he went up 8 pounds? He got bigger, stronger and had much more experience. I doubt Zamora would have gone up and beat a prime Eusebio. GTFOH! Sometimes you don't know what you are talking about.

[Kalan]

You don't know what you're talking about this time... Zamora destroyed Pedroza with an ordinary combination... Wiped him out... Zamora took a punch better, but his toughness was his undoing because he took a lot of them getting destroyed by Zarate...

Just as Pedroza couldn't handle Zamora's boxing style -- Zamora couldn't handle Zarate's.. Almost immediately he was being clubbed down with hooks.

[Nile4000]

Bernard Taylor never fought the quality competition he needed to get better. Even though I feel he beat Eusebio, he definitely didn't look good doing it. In his hometown, nonetheless.

You cannot win a fight by running like a chicken and not throwing punches. You gotta overwhelm the champion. Bernard Taylor got lucky for the draw. I saw the great Eusebio Pedroza retaining the title.

Bernard did a good job early in the fight by fouling Eusebio, letting him know he wouldn't get away with any funny business. Pedroza came on with the body attack a bit too late, but I think Bernard did just enough to win.

[elmersalsa]

Bernard Taylor never fought the quality competition he needed to get better. Even though I feel he beat Eusebio, he definitely didn't look good doing it. In his hometown, nonetheless.

You cannot win a fight by running like a chicken and not throwing punches. You gotta overwhelm the champion. Bernard Taylor got lucky for the draw. I saw the great Eusebio Pedroza retaining the title.

Bernard did a good job early in the fight by fouling Eusebio, letting him know he wouldn't get away with any funny business. Pedroza came on with the body attack a bit too late, but I think Bernard did just enough to win.

No, he didn't. Pedroza deserved the nod. Bernard didn't do nothing after the 8th round. You don't win a title fight by running. You gotta throw punches in bunches to defeat the champion. Pedroza was the way busier of the two.

[elmersalsa]

You don't know what you're talking about this time... Zamora destroyed Pedroza with an ordinary combination... Wiped him out... Zamora took a punch better, but his toughness was his undoing because he took a lot of them getting destroyed by Zarate...

Just as Pedroza couldn't handle Zamora's boxing style -- Zamora couldn't handle Zarate's.. Almost immediately he was being clubbed down with hooks.

And again, sometimes you don't know what you are talking about. Pedroza was too frail for the 118lbs division. Plus, he didn't had enough experience to fight for a title bid. His own countrymen didn't give him a shot to win a title against Zamora, who was a knockout artist at the time. He was about 24-0, all by knockout!

Boxing is about weight classifications. Pedroza was much more experienced and stronger at featherweight. Zamora would have not been that successful at featherweight because he was too short. And at the time that Pedroza was featherweight champ, Zamora was already blown out by the great Carlos Zarate and Jorge Lujan beat him so badly that Zamora retired after the fight. He was done. And you think a has been like Zamora would have beaten a prime Pedroza in '78? In a bigger weight class? The bigger the weight, the better for Eusebio.

[Controversial]

I'll have a go with Marciano.

Fought in the weakest era of the HW division. Carefully matched by his mob linked manager. Lost the fight to Ted Lowry who was said to be carrying Marciano after almost knocking him out early, likely to be fixed. Harry Haft was told to dive by Marciano's mob friends. Lost to LaStarza in their first fight. Overated power. Never fought a fighter in his prime, all were past their best. Poor title reign due to inactivity and half of his defences being rematches against guys he had already beaten. Dirty fighter who needed to use the heel of his hands, forearms, head-butts, low blows, punches after the bell and punches when guys were on the deck to gain an advantage. Should've been disqualified against Cockell but wasn't probably due to his mob links. Ducked Patterson.

[Nile4000]

You cannot win a fight by running like a chicken and not throwing punches. You gotta overwhelm the champion. Bernard Taylor got lucky for the draw. I saw the great Eusebio Pedroza retaining the title.

Bernard did a good job early in the fight by fouling Eusebio, letting him know he wouldn't get away with any funny business. Pedroza came on with the body attack a bit too late, but I think Bernard did just enough to win.

No, he didn't. Pedroza deserved the nod. Bernard didn't do nothing after the 8th round. You don't win a title fight by running. You gotta throw punches in bunches to defeat the champion. Pedroza was the way busier of the two.

Bernard was outboxing him the first 2/3rds of the fight. He did enough to win, for me anyway. Eusebio should've never accepted the fight in Charlotte to begin with.

[Nile4000]

Michael Dokes

Was not the strongest puncher. Don King got him out of at least 2 jams during his peak fighting years. Back from his amateur years, seemed to rush into things. Got someone else's title shot, though it truly wasn' his fault. Didn't fight all the contemporaries he could have, though he did better than Gerry Cooney in that department. Got caught up in the drug scene, which ruined his chance to clear his name in Weaver II.

[elmersalsa]

Bernard did a good job early in the fight by fouling Eusebio, letting him know he wouldn't get away with any funny business. Pedroza came on with the body attack a bit too late, but I think Bernard did just enough to win.

No, he didn't. Pedroza deserved the nod. Bernard didn't do nothing after the 8th round. You don't win a title fight by running. You gotta throw punches in bunches to defeat the champion. Pedroza was the way busier of the two.

Bernard was outboxing him the first 2/3rds of the fight. He did enough to win, for me anyway. Eusebio should've never accepted the fight in Charlotte to begin with.

We watched two different fights, I guess.

[Seamus]

Taylor did run alot in that fight, but Pedroza sure wasn't landing much. It was the kind of fight where you'd find a fair number of fight fans scoring it for the Panamanian simply because Taylor was so contact shy, but if you really look at who was landing, Taylor was stealing alot rds.

[Kalan]

You don't know what you're talking about this time... Zamora destroyed Pedroza with an ordinary combination... Wiped him out... Zamora took a punch better, but his toughness was his undoing because he took a lot of them getting destroyed by Zarate...

Just as Pedroza couldn't handle Zamora's boxing style -- Zamora couldn't handle Zarate's.. Almost immediately he was being clubbed down with hooks.

And again, sometimes you don't know what you are talking about. Pedroza was too frail for the 118lbs division. Plus, he didn't had enough experience to fight for a title bid. His own countrymen didn't give him a shot to win a title against Zamora, who was a knockout artist at the time. He was about 24-0, all by knockout!

Boxing is about weight classifications. Pedroza was much more experienced and stronger at featherweight. Zamora would have not been that successful at featherweight because he was too short. And at the time that Pedroza was featherweight champ, Zamora was already blown out by the great Carlos Zarate and Jorge Lujan beat him so badly that Zamora retired after the fight. He was done. And you think a has been like Zamora would have beaten a prime Pedroza in '78? In a bigger weight class? The bigger the weight, the better for Eusebio.

Zamora very easy knocked Pedroza out in 2 rounds when he DID fight him -- anything else is pure speculation... If Zamora never fought Zarate his career wouldn't have been over at 26.. Just like Salvador Shanchez would have been much better if he didn't die in an auto crash at 23.. Unfortunate events happen.

[Nile4000]

No, he didn't. Pedroza deserved the nod. Bernard didn't do nothing after the 8th round. You don't win a title fight by running. You gotta throw punches in bunches to defeat the champion. Pedroza was the way busier of the two.

Bernard was outboxing him the first 2/3rds of the fight. He did enough to win, for me anyway. Eusebio should've never accepted the fight in Charlotte to begin with.

We watched two different fights, I guess.

Maybe, going to look at it again, along with Norton-Young. Maybe Ken didn't win after all.

[Ambling Alp II]

Taylor did run alot in that fight, but Pedroza sure wasn't landing much. It was the kind of fight where you'd find a fair number of fight fans scoring it for the Panamanian simply because Taylor was so contact shy, but if you really look at who was landing, Taylor was stealing alot rds.

That is a good point. People should look at who is landing; not if someone is "running" or not. Sometimes the guy doing chasing is not actually landing more; sometimes he is.

[elmersalsa]

You don't know what you're talking about this time... Zamora destroyed Pedroza with an ordinary combination... Wiped him out... Zamora took a punch better, but his toughness was his undoing because he took a lot of them getting destroyed by Zarate...

Just as Pedroza couldn't handle Zamora's boxing style -- Zamora couldn't handle Zarate's.. Almost immediately he was being clubbed down with hooks.

And again, sometimes you don't know what you are talking about. Pedroza was too frail for the 118lbs division. Plus, he didn't had enough experience to fight for a title bid. His own countrymen didn't give him a shot to win a title against Zamora, who was a knockout artist at the time. He was about 24-0, all by knockout!

Boxing is about weight classifications. Pedroza was much more experienced and stronger at featherweight. Zamora would have not been that successful at featherweight because he was too short. And at the time that Pedroza was featherweight champ, Zamora was already blown out by the great Carlos Zarate and Jorge Lujan beat him so badly that Zamora retired after the fight. He was done. And you think a has been like Zamora would have beaten a prime Pedroza in '78? In a bigger weight class? The bigger the weight, the better for Eusebio.

Zamora very easy knocked Pedroza out in 2 rounds when he DID fight him -- anything else is pure speculation... If Zamora never fought Zarate his career wouldn't have been over at 26.. Just like Salvador Shanchez would have been much better if he didn't die in an auto crash at 23.. Unfortunate events happen.

He knocked him out easy, yes, at bantamweight and a very young and inexperienced Pedroza. Once Pedroza went to featherweight, he was a complete fighter. Zamora was just a banger. Nothing else. He would not beat Pedroza like that at featherweight were he was stronger and much experienced. Zamora knocked out a green Pedroza.

[elmersalsa]

You don't know what you're talking about this time... Zamora destroyed Pedroza with an ordinary combination... Wiped him out... Zamora took a punch better, but his toughness was his undoing because he took a lot of them getting destroyed by Zarate...

Just as Pedroza couldn't handle Zamora's boxing style -- Zamora couldn't handle Zarate's.. Almost immediately he was being clubbed down with hooks.

And again, sometimes you don't know what you are talking about. Pedroza was too frail for the 118lbs division. Plus, he didn't had enough experience to fight for a title bid. His own countrymen didn't give him a shot to win a title against Zamora, who was a knockout artist at the time. He was about 24-0, all by knockout!

Boxing is about weight classifications. Pedroza was much more experienced and stronger at featherweight. Zamora would have not been that successful at featherweight because he was too short. And at the time that Pedroza was featherweight champ, Zamora was already blown out by the great Carlos Zarate and Jorge Lujan beat him so badly that Zamora retired after the fight. He was done. And you think a has been like Zamora would have beaten a prime Pedroza in '78? In a bigger weight class? The bigger the weight, the better for Eusebio.

Zamora very easy knocked Pedroza out in 2 rounds when he DID fight him -- anything else is pure speculation... If Zamora never fought Zarate his career wouldn't have been over at 26.. Just like Salvador Shanchez would have been much better if he didn't die in an auto crash at 23.. Unfortunate events happen.

He knocked him out easy, yes, at bantamweight and a very young and inexperienced Pedroza. Once Pedroza went to featherweight, he was a complete fighter. Zamora was just a banger. Nothing else. He would not beat Pedroza like that at featherweight were he was stronger and much experienced. Zamora knocked out a green Pedroza.

[elmersalsa]

Taylor did run alot in that fight, but Pedroza sure wasn't landing much. It was the kind of fight where you'd find a fair number of fight fans scoring it for the Panamanian simply because Taylor was so contact shy, but if you really look at who was landing, Taylor was stealing alot rds.

That is a good point. People should look at who is landing; not if someone is "running" or not. Sometimes the guy doing chasing is not actually landing more; sometimes he is.

You gotta overwhelm the champion by throwing a lot of punches. You gotta impress the judges. Taylor didn't do that. He lost, and he shouldn't be crying about the outcome. It was Taylor's fault he didn't win, not Pedroza's.

[Nile4000]

Taylor did run alot in that fight, but Pedroza sure wasn't landing much. It was the kind of fight where you'd find a fair number of fight fans scoring it for the Panamanian simply because Taylor was so contact shy, but if you really look at who was landing, Taylor was stealing alot rds.

That is a good point. People should look at who is landing; not if someone is "running" or not. Sometimes the guy doing chasing is not actually landing more; sometimes he is.

You gotta overwhelm the champion by throwing a lot of punches. You gotta impress the judges. Taylor didn't do that. He lost, and he shouldn't be crying about the outcome. It was Taylor's fault he didn't win, not Pedroza's.

True, but Bernard was smart to get the fight in his hometown. Anywhere else, like Panama City, it is a loss.