The 5 Fights you wish would've gone different

[Ilya Muromets]

1) Norton-Bobick

2) Holmes-Cooney

3) Holyfield-Foreman

4) Watt-O'Grady

5) Hagler-Duran

And I actually liked the guys I was rooting against in these cases. I certainly didn't dislike any of them.

I forgot Young-Foreman. Guess I have to take Watt-O'Grady off.

And all those fixed Muhamid Ali fights - pick any four!

And Povetkin - Joshua. That makes six.

[Tony1244]

1) Norton-Bobick

2) Holmes-Cooney

3) Holyfield-Foreman

4) Watt-O'Grady

5) Hagler-Duran

And I actually liked the guys I was rooting against in these cases. I certainly didn't dislike any of them.

I forgot Young-Foreman. Guess I have to take Watt-O'Grady off.

And all those fixed Muhamid Ali fights - pick any four!

And Povetkin - Joshua. That makes six.

I re-watched the Jimmy Young. It was very close. Norton 3 was close too. You have to take it from the champ. I wouldn't call any of those fixes.

[Ilya Muromets]

And the two Golota-Bowe fights plus the two he got outright robbed in vs. Ruiz and Byrd.

[Ilya Muromets]

And all those fixed Muhamid Ali fights - pick any four!

And Povetkin - Joshua. That makes six.

I re-watched the Jimmy Young. It was very close. Norton 3 was close too. You have to take it from the champ. I wouldn't call any of those fixes.

I haven't seen it in a very long time but most say Young beat him. Same with Doug Jones. Henry Cooper 1 was blatant cheating by his corner who cut his glove open to gain him extra time between rounds when he was out on his feet. Liston took two dives. Even journeyman Alonzo Johnson beat him - and now they've cut out the post fight comments of the commentators who were saying "I don't believe it they gave it to Clay!" Same with Cooper 1, when ESPN classic replayed it they spliced the rounds together and said not one word about Angelo Dundee's monkey business as tho it never happened. George Foreman he beat by getting the ring ropes fixed. He even fixed the wrestler vs. boxer thing with Antonio Inoki. What am I leaving off? That makes how many so far, 20 or something!

[Ilya Muromets]

Here's two more: Ken Norton beat him all three times, AT LEAST 2 of the 3!

[squiggy]

Wow, I've always found Hamed-Barrera really satisfying.

[squiggy]

1. Castillo-Mayweather I: The judges that night had a huge effect on 21st century boxing. A Mayweather with a loss on his record would have forever been talking about how "everybody loses sometimes, and anyway I was hurt that night, and anyway I avenged that loss," but regardless, not having that perfect record to think about could have led him to take more risks.

2. Holmes-Spinks II: Fights where the screwed-over guy leaves the sport, even temporarily, are a sad situation. And I've always wondered if a Larry Holmes who continuously kept fighting throughout the mid-80s would have fared better against young Tyson. I bet he at least would have avoided the KO loss.

3. Chavez-Taylor I: Everyone knows that Taylor was beaten in the sense of "beaten to a pulp," but he really deserved to get that W. The fact that the powers that be even went on to preserve Chavez's '0' through a thorough beating by Whitaker made things even worse. And it sucks for such a good fighter to have that kind of albatross around his neck.

4. Hopkins-Jones I or II: I wish anything interesting whatsoever had happened in these fights. I'd trade away both fights for an alternate world where they fought in 2003 instead.

5. Alvarez-Golovkin I: The point where the Canelo favoritism just got too blatant.

[Thomastearns]

And all those fixed Muhamid Ali fights - pick any four!

And Povetkin - Joshua. That makes six.

I re-watched the Jimmy Young. It was very close. Norton 3 was close too. You have to take it from the champ. I wouldn't call any of those fixes.

"You have to take it from the champ"

That's how it should be but all too often it's the so-called A side not necessarily the champ who gets all the benefits.

Muhammad Ali was, strangely enough in hindsight, not the A side for most of his career - at least not til the resolution of his Vietnam ban in the early 70s and maybe also the Frazier defeat.

His record is more or less unblemished in comparison to almost anyone else. The second Norton and Frazier fights always raise eyebrows I think mainly because how far Ali's skills had deteriorated by then. We were getting used to seeing this new Ali for sure, but it doesn't mean he lost those fights.


The fights I wished that had ended differently were as follows,

Hearns v Barkley 1 where Tommy just got carried away by his own dazzling skills and forgot that the fight wasn't quite over yet.

Ali v Holmes / Berbick which shouldn't have been allowed.

Pacquiao v Mayweather a dire dull affair just when the whole world tuned in to see what modern day boxing was all about.

Golovkin v Alvarez 1 which underlined where boxing really is today.

Tyson v Holyfield / Lewis.
As they say timing is everything. It's a fundamental part of career strategy nowadays to try to avoid dangerous rivals and wait and wait til they're clearly on the downward slide of their careers.

'Brave' Canelo avoids one ageing fighter (GGG) to fight Kovalev who's even more of a shadow of his former self. He'll be calling out Mike Tyson next!

[bigjack]

Just the one for me Holmes V Michael Spinks 1

[Tony1244]

I re-watched the Jimmy Young. It was very close. Norton 3 was close too. You have to take it from the champ. I wouldn't call any of those fixes.

I haven't seen it in a very long time but most say Young beat him. Same with Doug Jones. Henry Cooper 1 was blatant cheating by his corner who cut his glove open to gain him extra time between rounds when he was out on his feet. Liston took two dives. Even journeyman Alonzo Johnson beat him - and now they've cut out the post fight comments of the commentators who were saying "I don't believe it they gave it to Clay!" Same with Cooper 1, when ESPN classic replayed it they spliced the rounds together and said not one word about Angelo Dundee's monkey business as tho it never happened. George Foreman he beat by getting the ring ropes fixed. He even fixed the wrestler vs. boxer thing with Antonio Inoki. What am I leaving off? That makes how many so far, 20 or something!

Ali would have beaten Cooper anyway. He certainly did in the rematch. I've watched that first fight many times and Ali recovered quickly. He got an extra minute, but I believe he would have won without the extra time as well. He got up quickly and got up again in between the round to test his legs.

I didn't even think Ali-Jones was close. Alonzo Johnson beat him? In checkers?

Norton 2 and 3 and Young were close. Those decisions bother me less than the constant holding Ali got away with against Frazier and Foreman.

[Ron C]

Lennox Lewis vs. Vitali Klitschko. God knows what would've happened if it kept going. I think either one of them could've scored a knock out at any moment. Too bad we'll never know who. Wish there would've been a rematch too.

[Syntax Error]

Graham V Brewer - Herol looked like he was finally going to bag himself a world title trinket at the ripe old age of 38 only to once again snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

Thompson V Nelson - I really wanted Thompson to beat Nelson as I couldn't stand Johnny at that time, but ironically, I've grown to like Nelson.

Hearns V Leonard 2 - Tommy deserved his victory over Leonard and he waited 8 long years to try and avenge his defeat, only to get screwed by the judges.

Lewis V McCall 1 - Because we might have seen Lewis V Bowe.

Williams V Vitali K - Williams shreds the admittedly aged Tyson, but Tyson nonetheless, gets rewarded with a shot at a trinket only to be completely outclassed by Vitali.

[Ilya Muromets]

I haven't seen it in a very long time but most say Young beat him. Same with Doug Jones. Henry Cooper 1 was blatant cheating by his corner who cut his glove open to gain him extra time between rounds when he was out on his feet. Liston took two dives. Even journeyman Alonzo Johnson beat him - and now they've cut out the post fight comments of the commentators who were saying "I don't believe it they gave it to Clay!" Same with Cooper 1, when ESPN classic replayed it they spliced the rounds together and said not one word about Angelo Dundee's monkey business as tho it never happened. George Foreman he beat by getting the ring ropes fixed. He even fixed the wrestler vs. boxer thing with Antonio Inoki. What am I leaving off? That makes how many so far, 20 or something!

Ali would have beaten Cooper anyway.


Would have could have should have, means nothing. The record books should be changed to show Cooper won the first fight, and that should have been done while Cooper was still living.

He certainly did in the rematch. I've watched that first fight many times and Ali recovered quickly. He got an extra minute, but I believe he would have won without the extra time as well. He got up quickly and got up again in between the round to test his legs.

It's controversial how much extra time he got to recover between rounds. They seem to have scoured all the original uncut films and now ESPN shows a deceitfully spliced version and doesn't even mention that anything at all happened. Dundee cut the glove with a blade (as he himself admitted) and I believe they had to send someone for a new glove. I think he got over four minutes to recover, but even if he got an extra 2 seconds it was by cheating and he lost.


I didn't even think Ali-Jones was close. Alonzo Johnson beat him? In checkers?

Johnson-Clay, the name he was using at the time, is online, at least it was, but they cut off the commentators post fight comments that used to be there, at least in the last version i saw.



Norton 2 and 3 and Young were close. Those decisions bother me less than the constant holding Ali got away with against Frazier and Foreman.

I think I'll watch some of those controversial fights again if they are online.

As you can see I'm no fan of the now all but deified Clay alias Ali. His screaming and yelling and cheating was the beginning of the end of sportsmanship in boxing and the beginning of turning boxing into something like WWE wrestling. He himself said he patterned his character after the wrestler Gorgeous George. Plus he was a member of the Black Muslim hate group which they now totally gloss over.

[margaret thatcher]

Nutjob

[Ilya Muromets]

"Norton 2 and 3 and Young were close. Those decisions bother me less than the constant holding Ali got away with against Frazier and Foreman."

I didn't even remember that. All I remember about the Foreman fight was how Ali had the ropes fixed for him and then he leaned back on them out of reach while Foreman knocked himself out. Foreman should have just backed off, or his corner should have told him to back off, when it became apparent what was happening.

[squiggy]

As you can see I'm no fan of the now all but deified Clay alias Ali. His screaming and yelling and cheating was the beginning of the end of sportsmanship in boxing and the beginning of turning boxing into something like WWE wrestling. He himself said he patterned his character after the wrestler Gorgeous George. Plus he was a member of the Black Muslim hate group which they now totally gloss over.

Maybe you want the thread to be "5 Kinds of People I Don't Like."

[Tony1244]

When someone writes that Ali-Cooper 1 should have been overturned, all their other opinions lose instant credibility.

If you hate him, fine, but you need to keep the debate real.

[MasterG]

I would have liked to see Mike Tyson beat James Douglas. As Mike was the best heavyweight in history It would have been nice to see him beat the padded record of Rocky Marciano.

Tyson if handled correctly he would have beaten that record and added some to it.

[Ilya Muromets]

When someone writes that Ali-Cooper 1 should have been overturned, all their other opinions lose instant credibility.

If you hate him, fine, but you need to keep the debate real.

Well that doesn't make any sense at all. In fact the exact opposite is the case, especially since Angelo Dundee admitted what he did. Still I wouldn't say anything as silly as "all their other opinions lose instant credibility". At any rate, end of discussion. The other guy is right, this thread has gone off on a tangent.

[Tony1244]

When someone writes that Ali-Cooper 1 should have been overturned, all their other opinions lose instant credibility.

If you hate him, fine, but you need to keep the debate real.

Well that doesn't make any sense at all. In fact the exact opposite is the case, especially since Angelo Dundee admitted what he did. Still I wouldn't say anything as silly as "all their other opinions lose instant credibility". At any rate, end of discussion. The other guy is right, this thread has gone off on a tangent.

There are too many fights with funny water bottles, long counts, short counts, short rounds, thumbs in eyes, cuts caused by headbutts. You'd have to overturn hundreds of fights.

Yes, to say that fight should be overturned is ridiculous.

[funso banjo baby]

Williams v Sprott 2
Hagler v Leonard
Williams v Samil Sam
Liston v Martin
Colin Jones v Don Curry

[gilgamesh]

When someone writes that Ali-Cooper 1 should have been overturned, all their other opinions lose instant credibility.

If you hate him, fine, but you need to keep the debate real.

Well that doesn't make any sense at all. In fact the exact opposite is the case, especially since Angelo Dundee admitted what he did. Still I wouldn't say anything as silly as "all their other opinions lose instant credibility". At any rate, end of discussion. The other guy is right, this thread has gone off on a tangent.

Ali haters who try to poke holes in every one of his fights come across as f*cking idiots.

He wasn't unbeatable, but he wasn't some sh*t fighter either.

You probably think he deserved to lose the decision against Rudi Lubbers too right?

[gilgamesh]

And all those fixed Muhamid Ali fights - pick any four!

And Povetkin - Joshua. That makes six.

I re-watched the Jimmy Young. It was very close. Norton 3 was close too. You have to take it from the champ. I wouldn't call any of those fixes.

Norton 3 was not close. Ken CLEARLY won that fight.

10 rounds to 5 is how I see it. 9 rounds to 6 is still a crystal clear victory....and anything closer than that...just no.

[gilgamesh]

I would have liked to see Mike Tyson beat James Douglas. As Mike was the best heavyweight in history It would have been nice to see him beat the padded record of Rocky Marciano.

Tyson if handled correctly he would have beaten that record and added some to it.

Interesting take considering he never came particularly close to Marciano's record, and would've lost to Holyfield ANY time they ever fought.

[Tony1244]

I re-watched the Jimmy Young. It was very close. Norton 3 was close too. You have to take it from the champ. I wouldn't call any of those fixes.

Norton 3 was not close. Ken CLEARLY won that fight.

10 rounds to 5 is how I see it. 9 rounds to 6 is still a crystal clear victory....and anything closer than that...just no.

Hey Ken, I thought you passed away. I haven't watched it in a long time but I remember 3 non official judges including Frazier scored it a draw. At the time I had it close to that. Can't remember exactly what I scored it to tell you the truth. Norton certainly landed the harder punches, but Ali landed a lot of junk jabs.