Round-by-Round: Saul 'Canelo' Alvarez vs. Billy Joe Saunders - May 8, 2021

[Enlightened-One]

It was a good fight that met my expectations.

Canelo has proven his greatness.

And assuming the injury isn’t permanent, then Billy Joe can come again.

He’s proven that he belongs in the big leagues.

And I’d still favour Billy Joe to beat Callum Smith, GGG and Demetrius Andrade.

[Enlightened-One]

CompuBox Stats

The punch count for the eighth round is wildly inaccurate.

It’s almost as if the CompuBox button pressers didn’t even watch the first 90 seconds of the 8th.

Billy Joe only landing five punches during the eighth round? Gimme a break!

[The Gratest]

Tibbs stopped the fight.

There’s no proof of Saunders demanding the stoppage.

It may or may not have happened, but there’s no proof either way.

All we know for certain (at this point in time) is that Tibbs stopped the fight.

We might subsequently discover that Saunders requested the stoppage, but it’s wrong to initially claim something without proof.

What did I claim?

I was responding to Jimmy.

Billy Joe’s trainer stopped the fight.

There’s no proof of him asking his trainer to stop the fight.

What actually transpired didn’t contradict Billy Joe’s hyperbole, because it was Tibbs that stopped the fight.

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

[Enlightened-One]

What did I claim?

I was responding to Jimmy.

Billy Joe’s trainer stopped the fight.

There’s no proof of him asking his trainer to stop the fight.

What actually transpired didn’t contradict Billy Joe’s hyperbole, because it was Tibbs that stopped the fight.

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

Billy Joe told his trainer that he couldn’t see.

This explains the head shaking.

Being disappointed about the injury, realising that chasing the victory had become a lost cause and also being powerless to prevent your trainer from stopping the fight, will probably make someone feel forlorn.

This explains the body language.

Either way, you’ve admitted there’s no definitive proof of Saunders asking his trainer to stop the fight.

By your own admission, you’re only speculating.

So why pretend you’re asserting that Billy Joe quitting is a fact, when you clearly have no definitive proof?

There’s no evidence of Billy Joe contradicting himself about his previous hyperbole.

[Jimmy2020]

What did I claim?

I was responding to Jimmy.

Billy Joe’s trainer stopped the fight.

There’s no proof of him asking his trainer to stop the fight.

What actually transpired didn’t contradict Billy Joe’s hyperbole, because it was Tibbs that stopped the fight.

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

That is how I interpreted it too. I know Mark Tibbs personally and there is no way on God's Green Earth he'd have pulled Joe then without being told it was okay by Joe himself or asked to by Joe himself.

[The Gratest]

I was responding to Jimmy.

Billy Joe’s trainer stopped the fight.

There’s no proof of him asking his trainer to stop the fight.

What actually transpired didn’t contradict Billy Joe’s hyperbole, because it was Tibbs that stopped the fight.

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

Billy Joe told his trainer that he couldn’t see.

This explains the head shaking.

Being disappointed about the injury, realising that chasing the victory had become a lost cause and also being powerless to prevent your trainer from stopping the fight, will probably make someone feel forlorn.

This explains the body language.

Either way, you’ve admitted there’s no definitive proof of Saunders asking his trainer to stop the fight.

By your own admission, you’re only speculating.

So why pretend you’re asserting that Billy Joe quitting is a fact, when you clearly have no definitive proof?

Sure.
From Mark Tibbs, he stopped it based on the response he got from Billy Joe.

[ironbeard]

"If my two eye sockets were broken, my jaw was broken, my teeth were out, my nose was smashed, my brain was beaten, I was not stopping until I was knocked out or worse"

https://www.dazn.com/en-GB/news/boxing/ ... z5pvw4m0m4

Talk is cheap marketing.

It also comes back to bite you on the bum at times.

BJS's was fighting well, getting through with a few jabs and that left uppercut to the body was making Canelo think a bit more.
That was a beautiful slip and counter by Canelo though. I've often thought of him as a bit of a pre-programmed trained robot at times, but he does think on is feet and adjust during the fight. BJS was crouching in low and Canelo timed that move to perfection.

Canelo has continually improved. To Saunders credit, he did make Canelo miss more than he generally does, but few have mentioned how many BJS shots Canelo slipped.

Hard to argue with the man’s hard work, dedication and accomplishments.

[Enlightened-One]

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

Billy Joe told his trainer that he couldn’t see.

This explains the head shaking.

Being disappointed about the injury, realising that chasing the victory had become a lost cause and also being powerless to prevent your trainer from stopping the fight, will probably make someone feel forlorn.

This explains the body language.

Either way, you’ve admitted there’s no definitive proof of Saunders asking his trainer to stop the fight.

By your own admission, you’re only speculating.

So why pretend you’re asserting that Billy Joe quitting is a fact, when you clearly have no definitive proof?

Sure.
From Mark Tibbs, he stopped it based on the response he got from Billy Joe.

Saunders told Tibbs he couldn’t see. Eddie Hearn already confirmed this. That’s the response Tibbs didn’t want to hear.

There is no evidence of Saunders actually telling his corner to stop the fight.

For sure, Tibbs is experienced enough to read between the lines, gauge the injury, body language and also acknowledge Saunders feedback about not being able to see... and then reasonably decide to stop the fight.

It seems we kind of agree, except you’re claiming that Saunders verbally told his corner he wanted to quit, which simply didn’t happen.

[The Gratest]

Billy Joe told his trainer that he couldn’t see.

This explains the head shaking.

Being disappointed about the injury, realising that chasing the victory had become a lost cause and also being powerless to prevent your trainer from stopping the fight, will probably make someone feel forlorn.

This explains the body language.

Either way, you’ve admitted there’s no definitive proof of Saunders asking his trainer to stop the fight.

By your own admission, you’re only speculating.

So why pretend you’re asserting that Billy Joe quitting is a fact, when you clearly have no definitive proof?

Sure.
From Mark Tibbs, he stopped it based on the response he got from Billy Joe.

Saunders told Tibbs he couldn’t see. Eddie Hearn already confirmed this. That’s the response Tibbs didn’t want to hear.

There is no evidence of Saunders actually telling his corner to stop the fight.

For sure, Tibbs is experienced enough to read between the lines, gauge the injury, body language and also acknowledge Saunders feedback about not being able to see... and then reasonably decide to stop the fight.

It seems we kind of agree, expect you’re claiming that Saunders verbally told his corner he wanted to quit, which simply didn’t happen.

Where did I claim that?

[Enlightened-One]

Sure.
From Mark Tibbs, he stopped it based on the response he got from Billy Joe.

Saunders told Tibbs he couldn’t see. Eddie Hearn already confirmed this. That’s the response Tibbs didn’t want to hear.

There is no evidence of Saunders actually telling his corner to stop the fight.

For sure, Tibbs is experienced enough to read between the lines, gauge the injury, body language and also acknowledge Saunders feedback about not being able to see... and then reasonably decide to stop the fight.

It seems we kind of agree, expect you’re claiming that Saunders verbally told his corner he wanted to quit, which simply didn’t happen.

Where did I claim that?

You said that Saunders deserved to be criticised for previously saying he wouldn’t quit.

You then posted a video of Saunders own trainer, Jimmy Tibbs, explicitly stating the fact that Billy Joe didn’t quit.

I’m utterly confused as to the reason you keep responding to me.

All I keep doing is repeating myself, with others providing proof of me being correct, about Jimmy Tibbs deciding to end the fight.

Billy Joe was in pain, suffering an eye injury that was severe enough to render his hopes of victory as being a lost cause.

Tibbs made an obvious decision.

Remind me, what are we actually arguing about, because your own video 100% endorses everything I’ve claimed?

[Enlightened-One]

I know Mark Tibbs personally and there is no way on God's Green Earth he'd have pulled Joe then without being told it was okay by Joe himself or asked to by Joe himself.

Well Jimmy Tibbs confirmed that Billy Joe didn’t explicitly ask for the fight to be stopped.

Jimmy Tibbs said that he made the call.

The stoppage was the right call, but why are people pretending that Billy Joe verbally asked for the fight to be stopped, when it definitely didn’t happen.

[The Gratest]

Saunders told Tibbs he couldn’t see. Eddie Hearn already confirmed this. That’s the response Tibbs didn’t want to hear.

There is no evidence of Saunders actually telling his corner to stop the fight.

For sure, Tibbs is experienced enough to read between the lines, gauge the injury, body language and also acknowledge Saunders feedback about not being able to see... and then reasonably decide to stop the fight.

It seems we kind of agree, expect you’re claiming that Saunders verbally told his corner he wanted to quit, which simply didn’t happen.

Where did I claim that?

You said that Saunders deserved to be criticised for previously saying he wouldn’t quit.

You then posted a video of Saunders own trainer, Jimmy Tibbs, explicitly stating the fact that Billy Joe didn’t quit.

I’m utterly confused as to the reason you keep responding to me.

All I keep doing is repeating myself, with other providing proof of me being correct, about Jimmy Tibbs deciding to end the fight.

Remind me, what are we actually arguing about, because your own video 100% endorses everything I’ve claimed?

I never said that, now you're just making things up.
I've never once mentioned the word quit. You have, several times.
I've never said that Jimmy Tibbs didn't stop the fight, even though it's actually his son Mark Tibbs, but that's the job of the corner to officially inform the ref.
If you can't remember my original post that you got all upset about and now need to start making things up to cover your mistakes then we agree, it's pointless you repeating yourself.

[The Gratest]

I know Mark Tibbs personally and there is no way on God's Green Earth he'd have pulled Joe then without being told it was okay by Joe himself or asked to by Joe himself.

Well Jimmy Tibbs confirmed that Billy Joe didn’t explicitly ask for the fight to be stopped.

Jimmy Tibbs said that he made the call.

The stoppage was the right call, but why are people pretending that Billy Joe verbally asked for the fight to be stopped, when it definitely didn’t happen.

Jimmy Tibbs wasn't in his corner.

[Enlightened-One]

Where did I claim that?

You said that Saunders deserved to be criticised for previously saying he wouldn’t quit.

You then posted a video of Saunders own trainer, Jimmy Tibbs, explicitly stating the fact that Billy Joe didn’t quit.

I’m utterly confused as to the reason you keep responding to me.

All I keep doing is repeating myself, with other providing proof of me being correct, about Jimmy Tibbs deciding to end the fight.

Remind me, what are we actually arguing about, because your own video 100% endorses everything I’ve claimed?

I never said that, now you're just making things up.
I've never once mentioned the word quit. You have, several times.
I've never said that Jimmy Tibbs didn't stop the fight, even though it's actually his son Mark Tibbs, but that's the job of the corner to officially inform the ref.
If you can't remember my original post that you got all upset about and now need to start making things up to cover your mistakes then we agree, it's pointless you repeating yourself.

Just answer three simple questions? They only need yes or no answers.

Did you not quote Billy Joe’s own words about his refusal to quit under any circumstance?

Did you not say he deserves to be criticised for saying he wouldn’t quit, due to his subsequent retirement between rounds against Canelo?

And did you not post a video claiming that Tibbs stopped the fight based on Billy Joe’s words?

[Enlightened-One]

I know Mark Tibbs personally and there is no way on God's Green Earth he'd have pulled Joe then without being told it was okay by Joe himself or asked to by Joe himself.

Well Jimmy Tibbs confirmed that Billy Joe didn’t explicitly ask for the fight to be stopped.

Jimmy Tibbs said that he made the call.

The stoppage was the right call, but why are people pretending that Billy Joe verbally asked for the fight to be stopped, when it definitely didn’t happen.

Jimmy Tibbs wasn't in his corner.

Typo. Doesn’t invalidate what I wrote.

Your own video confirms everything I wrote.

I still don’t understand why you feel that Saunders deserves to be criticised for his corner stopping the fight?

[The Gratest]

You said that Saunders deserved to be criticised for previously saying he wouldn’t quit.

You then posted a video of Saunders own trainer, Jimmy Tibbs, explicitly stating the fact that Billy Joe didn’t quit.

I’m utterly confused as to the reason you keep responding to me.

All I keep doing is repeating myself, with other providing proof of me being correct, about Jimmy Tibbs deciding to end the fight.

Remind me, what are we actually arguing about, because your own video 100% endorses everything I’ve claimed?

I never said that, now you're just making things up.
I've never once mentioned the word quit. You have, several times.
I've never said that Jimmy Tibbs didn't stop the fight, even though it's actually his son Mark Tibbs, but that's the job of the corner to officially inform the ref.
If you can't remember my original post that you got all upset about and now need to start making things up to cover your mistakes then we agree, it's pointless you repeating yourself.

Just answer three simple questions? They only need yes or no answers.

Did you not quote Billy Joe’s own words about his refusal to quit under any circumstance?

Did you not say he deserves to be criticised for saying he wouldn’t quit, due to his subsequent retirement between rounds against Canelo?

And did you not post a video claiming that Tibbs stopped the fight based on Billy Joe’s words?

I see you're unable to actually find and quote me saying those things so now desperately trying to spin it to save face.

Quote me saying those words as you claim first, and then i'll answer your questions. If you can't quote me then be quiet and stop twisting words.

[The Gratest]

Well Jimmy Tibbs confirmed that Billy Joe didn’t explicitly ask for the fight to be stopped.

Jimmy Tibbs said that he made the call.

The stoppage was the right call, but why are people pretending that Billy Joe verbally asked for the fight to be stopped, when it definitely didn’t happen.

Jimmy Tibbs wasn't in his corner.

Typo. Doesn’t invalidate what I wrote.

Your own video confirms everything I wrote.

I still don’t understand why you feel that Saunders deserves to be criticised for his corner stopping the fight?

No, a typo is when you accidentally hit the wrong letter. Getting the person completely wrong is lack of knowledge on the matter.

[Enlightened-One]

I see you're unable to actually find and quote me saying those things so now desperately trying to spin it to save face.

Quote me saying those words as you claim first, and then i'll answer your questions. If you can't quote me then be quiet and stop twisting words.

"If my two eye sockets were broken, my jaw was broken, my teeth were out, my nose was smashed, my brain was beaten, I was not stopping until I was knocked out or worse"

https://www.dazn.com/en-GB/news/boxing/ ... z5pvw4m0m4

Talk is cheap marketing.

It also comes back to bite you on the bum at times.

Billy Joe’s trainer stopped the fight.

There’s no proof of him asking his trainer to stop the fight.

What actually transpired didn’t contradict Billy Joe’s hyperbole, because it was Tibbs that stopped the fight.

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

From Mark Tibbs, he stopped it based on the response he got from Billy Joe.

There you go.

And for the record, YOUR video (the one you posted) backs up everything I’ve been saying all along.

[The Gratest]

I see you're unable to actually find and quote me saying those things so now desperately trying to spin it to save face.

Quote me saying those words as you claim first, and then i'll answer your questions. If you can't quote me then be quiet and stop twisting words.

Talk is cheap marketing.

It also comes back to bite you on the bum at times.

Billy Joe’s trainer stopped the fight.

There’s no proof of him asking his trainer to stop the fight.

What actually transpired didn’t contradict Billy Joe’s hyperbole, because it was Tibbs that stopped the fight.

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

From Mark Tibbs, he stopped it based on the response he got from Billy Joe.

None of those posts contain what you claim I said, so you've actually failed.
I think, in your excitement, you've actually got me confused with other posters who did actually criticise him for quitting, but now you're in too deep to admit I didn't type those words so just trying to fluff it out to save face.

[Enlightened-One]

I see you're unable to actually find and quote me saying those things so now desperately trying to spin it to save face.

Quote me saying those words as you claim first, and then i'll answer your questions. If you can't quote me then be quiet and stop twisting words.

It also comes back to bite you on the bum at times.

BJS's shook his head twice when responding to questions from Tibbs in the corner and never offered any objection. His body language was that he wanted no more, he played his part.

From Mark Tibbs, he stopped it based on the response he got from Billy Joe.

None of those posts contain what you claim I said, so you've actually failed.
I think, in your excitement, you've actually got me confused with other posters who did actually criticise him for quitting, but now you're in too deep to admit I didn't type those words so just trying to fluff it out to save face.

I’ve quoted your own words.

And you pretended I was twisting them. You then refused to answer three simple yes or no type questions.

End of discussion.

[The Gratest]

Of course it's the end of the discussion because you can't actually quote me directly with the words that you claim I said.
Rather ironically, you're quitting.

[Jimmy2020]

Nobody has claimed Billy said "I quit". He didn't need to. When Mark asked him if he wanted to fight on, he said precisely nothing. A first for Joe perhaps.

[Aftermath]

Canelo seem to be hard to like once you get past the Nationalism of Messican- Americans. He keeps winning and it is no fault of his own but he makes it hard to like for some reason.

Hard to like? Canelo just drew 70,000 and broke Ali's record. Nobody else in the US does that.

It's ok for black Americans to cheer wildly for Joe Louis and Ali, or for Filipinos to cheer for Pacquiao. When Mexican and Mexican-Americans cheer their champions the ignorant bigots right away start in with, "Oh no! That can't be good." Meanwhile Mexican fighters consistantly draw the biggest crowds and occupy the Top Ten Pound-For-Pound lists.

After Morales-Barrera III, Ring Magazine wrote, "Thank the good Lord for the Mexican boxer." During the Olympics, the World Cup and in boxing everyone cheers for their own. There's nothing wrong with with that as long as it's not disrespectful towards anyone else. In Mexican boxing there's plenty to cheer about.

[The Gratest]

Nobody has claimed Billy said "I quit". He didn't need to. When Mark asked him if he wanted to fight on, he said precisely nothing. A first for Joe perhaps.

Exactly, just EO flying off the handle as usual and adding his words to other's posts. Just can't help himself.

[The Gratest]

Mark Tibbs, based on the response from BJS, informed him that he was going to stop the fight and there was no objection from BJS, he accepted it, which was the smart thing to do in the long run.

There was no 'Don't stop the fight! I'm not stopping until both my eye sockets are broken, my teeth are out, my nose smashed, my brain beaten or knocked out or worse!!". (As per earlier BJS quote)
The pain from a shattered orbital bone must be incredible, something BJS has possibly never experienced before until now, so he was a bit daft to criticise DD in that department.

Ben Baby (@Ben_Baby) Tweeted: Talked to Mark Tibbs, Billy Joe Saunders' trainer. Said it was his call to stop the fight and there wasn't any objection from others in the corner, including his fighter. Tibbs: "He's a young man. He's got a family. He's got children. I've known him a... https://t.co/jr3ENYax1L