Who had the best chin - Steve Collins or Chris Eubank (Senior)?

[polecateddy]

Eubank snr. And Calzaghe's and Froch's probably better than both Eubank's and Collins'.

Whartons.

Henry?

It will be. It certainly was very solid. Only the flakey Italian ever floored him I think. He took a bit of a shelling against Eubank, which effectively broke him as a fighter. I would be hesitant to say it was definitely as good a chin as Eubank and Froch, who both regularly took more punishment.

[mickey1975]

Whartons.

Henry?

It will be. It certainly was very solid. Only the flakey Italian ever floored him I think. He took a bit of a shelling against Eubank, which effectively broke him as a fighter. I would be hesitant to say it was definitely as good a chin as Eubank and Froch, who both regularly took more punishment.

Square feet against Nardiello.

[orbtastic]

Benn hit him with a huge right cross flush on the chin and it just moved him sideways.

I watched the Eubank fight in some pub in York. Bit of a locals casuals pub, very pro Wharton. It was a painful watch but despite the eye injury I don’t think he was particularly hurt or in trouble.

[polecateddy]

Benn hit him with a huge right cross flush on the chin and it just moved him sideways.

I watched the Eubank fight in some pub in York. Bit of a locals casuals pub, very pro Wharton. It was a painful watch but despite the eye injury I don’t think he was particularly hurt or in trouble.

I think Wharton said he held back too much against Benn, so in what was his last shot he gave it everything against Eubank. I think Wharton was pretty out on his feet through exhaustion by the end of that one. Eubank probably was capable of putting him away but didn’t really have the killer instinct anymore.

[mickey1975]

Benn hit him with a huge right cross flush on the chin and it just moved him sideways.

I watched the Eubank fight in some pub in York. Bit of a locals casuals pub, very pro Wharton. It was a painful watch but despite the eye injury I don’t think he was particularly hurt or in trouble.

I think Wharton said he held back too much against Benn, so in what was his last shot he gave it everything against Eubank. I think Wharton was pretty out on his feet through exhaustion by the end of that one. Eubank probably was capable of putting him away but didn’t really have the killer instinct anymore.

Which isn't true. Chris was more tired

[skanksta]

For me Eubank. Even when he has hurt he was very aware. The knockdowns were often off balance type scenarios.

I mean look at his head! It's like a bowling ball in size and solidity. Like McCall. Seemed impossible to genuinely knockout.

Gotta be Eubank.

I think so much of what we call "chin" is mental.
A combination of incredible fitness and sheer bloody-mindedness. "You can't knock me out" sorta thing. Collins famously hypnotized etc.

But Eubank..,
He's the sort of guy that was born with a natural "physical chin". Look at his head indeed ! When Petr Cech nearly died from a nasty knee to the head it turned out he had an unusually thin skull. You could never tell looking at him, but he just a slimmer bone structure than most. With Eubank you can see it !
His huge thick skull is a natural outlier.

Added to his mental game,, it gave him a GOAT style chin.

[THEBUTCH]

Eubank more tired than Wharton at the end of their fight, mickey1975 ???

Who won the contest ?

You don't get results because you haven't emptied your tank by the finish....it's what separates world champions from the 'also rans'.

I'd much rather have the win and be exhausted, than losing but being able to claim I wasn't as knackered as my opponent !

What a bizarro ideology that is

[mickey1975]

Eubank more tired than Wharton at the end of their fight, mickey1975 ???

Who won the contest ?

You don't get results because you haven't emptied your tank by the finish....it's what separates world champions from the 'also rans'.

I'd much rather have the win and be exhausted, than losing but being able to claim I wasn't as knackered as my opponent !

What a bizarro ideology that is

I definitely think he had more rounds in the bank than Benn. He wasn't going anywhere from Eubank either. Also caught Reid in the last. A real twelve round fighter.

[THEBUTCH]

Henry was a bloody good fighter, without question, but don't you think some of your angles are a bit disingenuous

Also, square footed or not when he got crunched by Nardielo...he was hurt big time. Fair play to Wharton for coming back and doing the business

[THEBUTCH]

Chin's don't come much, or any, better than Froch.

[mickey1975]

Henry was a bloody good fighter, without question, but don't you think some of your angles are a bit disingenuous

Also, square footed or not when he got crunched by Nardielo...he was hurt big time. Fair play to Wharton for coming back and doing the business

Not really. I don't need any angles. He swears he wasn't hurt by Nardiello. He will openly tell you Eubank was the hardest man he ever shared a ring with.

[margaret thatcher]

Chin's don't come much, or any, better than Froch.

they certainly can come better, froch was dropped hard twice and rattled a couple other times. there are some fighters who were so durable they were never even down, or had at most 1 case of being buzzed. mccall, chuvalo, and hagler for example. more recently wach, golovkin, canelo, provo, vitali, abraham, and the great dave allen.

froch was hard as f@ck but not among the very hardest freak tier for chin

[THEBUTCH]

mickey1975, well if Wharton said he wasn't hurt against Nardielo I suppose he should know, but I just find that hard to take on board.

If Eubank was the hardest man he boxed, and he was a hardman, I would still argue it's a good job he didn't face Froch or Calzaghe.


Maggie, we won't see eye to eye on this subject. For me having a top tier chin is ultimately proven by how prepared you are to put yourself in the danger zone if it means getting the win.

Apart from his loss to Ward, Froch was prepared to do just that if needed and did this his whole career and against top grade opposition.

I willingly accept Hagler, Golovkin and Canelo but I don't think that goes against the point I made.

Dave Allen has a sound chin at Area/English level...if he'd have tried to win against Whyte, Yoka or Ortiz rather than just try to withstand punches I'm sure he would have got stopped or dropped.

I don't buy into Allen's "teak" toughness.

[mickey1975]

mickey1975, well if Wharton said he wasn't hurt against Nardielo I suppose he should know, but I just find that hard to take on board.

If Eubank was the hardest man he boxed, and he was a hardman, I would still argue it's a good job he didn't face Froch or Calzaghe.


Maggie, we won't see eye to eye on this subject. For me having a top tier chin is ultimately proven by how prepared you are to put yourself in the danger zone if it means getting the win.

Apart from his loss to Ward, Froch was prepared to do just that if needed and did this his whole career and against top grade opposition.

I willingly accept Hagler, Golovkin and Canelo but I don't think that goes against the point I made.

Dave Allen has a sound chin at Area/English level...if he'd have tried to win against Whyte, Yoka or Ortiz rather than just try to withstand punches I'm sure he would have got stopped or dropped.

I don't buy into Allen's "teak" toughness.

Henry will say Glenwood Brown in the amateurs as well when he was young.

[Steveh583]

Chin's don't come much, or any, better than Froch.

they certainly can come better, froch was dropped hard twice and rattled a couple other times. there are some fighters who were so durable they were never even down, or had at most 1 case of being buzzed. mccall, chuvalo, and hagler for example. more recently wach, golovkin, canelo, provo, vitali, abraham, and the great dave allen.

froch was hard as f@ck but not among the very hardest freak tier for chin

McCullough too

[JamesPhilips]

Chin's don't come much, or any, better than Froch.

I don’t believe Eubank would’ve gone over so hard from the Groves shot as Froch did. Even though it was a great punch

[stujones]

Not sure how people can say Collins' chin was over rated - the first Eubank fight aside, I cannot remember him being hurt as a Super Middlewight. .

He suffered a flash, almost embarrassing KD vs that American Fireman but he took some of Eubanks and Benn's best shots and from the Eubank rematch on, just looked like an animal that couldn't be moved.

Whilst Nigel Benn was shot in their fights - he still carried power and there were times in both fights where he caught Collins absolutely flush on the chin and Collins just brushed it off. I honestly think that broke Benn's heart in the rematch.

Not saying it was better than Eubank - but at the same time don't think we can say his chin was over rated cos its not like he showed he was hurt at all really. Now boxing ability etc is a different debate.

On a pure chin debate, I would just (just) edge it to Collins if I had to be asked mainly because Eubank had a better defence and ability to ride the shots - Collins took some whacks from Eubank and Benn that were flush on the chin.

Skill wise and athleticm - whilst I think Collins' ability is somewhat underrated - I would have Benn, Eubank and Calzaghe ahead of him. Froch it would have been interesting. However, pure STRENGTH at 12 stone - Collins would be my #1, not just in the UK. Eubank was strong at 12 stone, but Collins looked like he was in a different weight class. I would probably have Froch at #2 in terms of pure strength for the weight.

[margaret thatcher]

mickey1975, well if Wharton said he wasn't hurt against Nardielo I suppose he should know, but I just find that hard to take on board.

If Eubank was the hardest man he boxed, and he was a hardman, I would still argue it's a good job he didn't face Froch or Calzaghe.


Maggie, we won't see eye to eye on this subject. For me having a top tier chin is ultimately proven by how prepared you are to put yourself in the danger zone if it means getting the win.

Apart from his loss to Ward, Froch was prepared to do just that if needed and did this his whole career and against top grade opposition.

I willingly accept Hagler, Golovkin and Canelo but I don't think that goes against the point I made.

Dave Allen has a sound chin at Area/English level...if he'd have tried to win against Whyte, Yoka or Ortiz rather than just try to withstand punches I'm sure he would have got stopped or dropped.

I don't buy into Allen's "teak" toughness.

some durable guys fought more in journey man mode true, but certainly not all of them. of those i listed id say only really allen did it. sure, a guy like chuvalo or provo didnt win at the highest level, but they absolutely went for it and fought with their opponents, not just came to survive.

froch is super iron but defo not among the highest tier freak chins. and i mean, isnt so much of froch;s strength as a fighter his will to battle back when he's been in trouble and it's not all going his way? in fights like groves and taylor that's what preciesly helped make his legend. he also sagged vs kessler then battled back and won the next round big. him having that slight touch of vulnerability that the freak chins like hagler and co didnt, and being able to battle back, is part of his story

so id put him at the tier below the very best chins for sure, but still very high. its only the absolute best (ones that rank on an atg sclae) which rank higher. domestically very few fighters were more durable, though i would agree with others on eubank and mccullough. wayne took some real big shots from naz and morales - every bit the punchers as taylor and groves- and never budged, that's impressive.

[polecateddy]

There was a Paraguay fighter both Eubank and Benn fought, Juan Carlos Gimenez who had a shock absorber chin. But he was just a journeyman in terms of fighting ability really.

[dookus]

Not sure how people can say Collins' chin was over rated - the first Eubank fight aside, I cannot remember him being hurt as a Super Middlewight. .

He suffered a flash, almost embarrassing KD vs that American Fireman but he took some of Eubanks and Benn's best shots and from the Eubank rematch on, just looked like an animal that couldn't be moved.

Whilst Nigel Benn was shot in their fights - he still carried power and there were times in both fights where he caught Collins absolutely flush on the chin and Collins just brushed it off. I honestly think that broke Benn's heart in the rematch.

Not saying it was better than Eubank - but at the same time don't think we can say his chin was over rated cos its not like he showed he was hurt at all really. Now boxing ability etc is a different debate.

On a pure chin debate, I would just (just) edge it to Collins if I had to be asked mainly because Eubank had a better defence and ability to ride the shots - Collins took some whacks from Eubank and Benn that were flush on the chin.

Skill wise and athleticm - whilst I think Collins' ability is somewhat underrated - I would have Benn, Eubank and Calzaghe ahead of him. Froch it would have been interesting. However, pure STRENGTH at 12 stone - Collins would be my #1, not just in the UK. Eubank was strong at 12 stone, but Collins looked like he was in a different weight class. I would probably have Froch at #2 in terms of pure strength for the weight.

Benn landed an absolutely perfect flush left hook on Collins in round 3 of their first fight. Collins would later say "I thought he had broken all of my teeth and this horrible taste filled my mouth." And he still walked right through it!

[polecateddy]

Not sure how people can say Collins' chin was over rated - the first Eubank fight aside, I cannot remember him being hurt as a Super Middlewight. .

He suffered a flash, almost embarrassing KD vs that American Fireman but he took some of Eubanks and Benn's best shots and from the Eubank rematch on, just looked like an animal that couldn't be moved.

Whilst Nigel Benn was shot in their fights - he still carried power and there were times in both fights where he caught Collins absolutely flush on the chin and Collins just brushed it off. I honestly think that broke Benn's heart in the rematch.

Not saying it was better than Eubank - but at the same time don't think we can say his chin was over rated cos its not like he showed he was hurt at all really. Now boxing ability etc is a different debate.

On a pure chin debate, I would just (just) edge it to Collins if I had to be asked mainly because Eubank had a better defence and ability to ride the shots - Collins took some whacks from Eubank and Benn that were flush on the chin.

Skill wise and athleticm - whilst I think Collins' ability is somewhat underrated - I would have Benn, Eubank and Calzaghe ahead of him. Froch it would have been interesting. However, pure STRENGTH at 12 stone - Collins would be my #1, not just in the UK. Eubank was strong at 12 stone, but Collins looked like he was in a different weight class. I would probably have Froch at #2 in terms of pure strength for the weight.

Benn landed an absolutely perfect flush left hook on Collins in round 3 of their first fight. Collins would later say "I thought he had broken all of my teeth and this horrible taste filled my mouth." And he still walked right through it!

I don’t think hard core boxing fans give Collins a huge amount of credit for those Eubank and Benn wins. Benn was certainly done after the Gerald fight. He was ragged and off-target from then on. Eubank was just generally worn out by then too. I’d think a fresher Eubank and a Benn doing more boxing and less slugging circa Eubank/Benn 2 would have been able to decision the slower Collins.

[Noxy]

Not sure how people can say Collins' chin was over rated - the first Eubank fight aside, I cannot remember him being hurt as a Super Middlewight. .

He suffered a flash, almost embarrassing KD vs that American Fireman but he took some of Eubanks and Benn's best shots and from the Eubank rematch on, just looked like an animal that couldn't be moved.

Whilst Nigel Benn was shot in their fights - he still carried power and there were times in both fights where he caught Collins absolutely flush on the chin and Collins just brushed it off. I honestly think that broke Benn's heart in the rematch.

Not saying it was better than Eubank - but at the same time don't think we can say his chin was over rated cos its not like he showed he was hurt at all really. Now boxing ability etc is a different debate.

On a pure chin debate, I would just (just) edge it to Collins if I had to be asked mainly because Eubank had a better defence and ability to ride the shots - Collins took some whacks from Eubank and Benn that were flush on the chin.

Skill wise and athleticm - whilst I think Collins' ability is somewhat underrated - I would have Benn, Eubank and Calzaghe ahead of him. Froch it would have been interesting. However, pure STRENGTH at 12 stone - Collins would be my #1, not just in the UK. Eubank was strong at 12 stone, but Collins looked like he was in a different weight class. I would probably have Froch at #2 in terms of pure strength for the weight.

Benn landed an absolutely perfect flush left hook on Collins in round 3 of their first fight. Collins would later say "I thought he had broken all of my teeth and this horrible taste filled my mouth." And he still walked right through it!

I don’t think hard core boxing fans give Collins a huge amount of credit for those Eubank and Benn wins. Benn was certainly done after the Gerald fight. He was ragged and off-target from then on. Eubank was just generally worn out by then too. I’d think a fresher Eubank and a Benn doing more boxing and less slugging circa Eubank/Benn 2 would have been able to decision the slower Collins.

I don’t, but we’ve had this before on boxrec. I think Collins had the style to beat them whenever they would have met.

[stujones]

It is odd - Collins doesn't get the credit for the Eubank win - but Calzaghe beats and older, rustier weight drained Eubank (who was training for his light heavy debut) but gets a shit load of credit. I think Joe should credit Steve for giving him the blue print.

Yes - I agree on Benn, but Benn whacked him completely flush on the chin (now he probably wouldn't have landed vs a prime Eubank or Calzaghe) and there was no doubting that had he landed the shots he landed on Collins vs any other champion at the time, he would have been a world champion again. Purely to showcase his chin - Collins should get credit for the Benn fight.

[mickey1975]

He can have the credit for the first win, the second it's an open secret in boxing in boxing Benn did his weight in the sauna and was there for the cash.

[coghaugen11]

mickey1975, well if Wharton said he wasn't hurt against Nardielo I suppose he should know, but I just find that hard to take on board.

If Eubank was the hardest man he boxed, and he was a hardman, I would still argue it's a good job he didn't face Froch or Calzaghe.


Maggie, we won't see eye to eye on this subject. For me having a top tier chin is ultimately proven by how prepared you are to put yourself in the danger zone if it means getting the win.

Apart from his loss to Ward, Froch was prepared to do just that if needed and did this his whole career and against top grade opposition.

I willingly accept Hagler, Golovkin and Canelo but I don't think that goes against the point I made.

Dave Allen has a sound chin at Area/English level...if he'd have tried to win against Whyte, Yoka or Ortiz rather than just try to withstand punches I'm sure he would have got stopped or dropped.

I don't buy into Allen's "teak" toughness.

Henry will say Glenwood Brown in the amateurs as well when he was young.

Eubank sparred him at Gleasons Gym in late 87.