Lightwieghts: Ray "Boom Boom" Mancini vs Arturo Ga

generic screen name · Post by **generic screen name** » 01 Oct 2006, 22:57

He's better than Marvis Frazier!! He lasted longer against Tyson!!!!!

Scaff fought Tim Witherspoon and Mike Tyson back to back don't underestimate the resume of the former West Virginia State Champion!!

Neo · Post by **Neo** » 04 Oct 2006, 09:42

generic screen name wrote:He's better than Marvis Frazier!! He lasted longer against Tyson!!!!!

Scaff fought Tim Witherspoon and Mike Tyson back to back don't underestimate the resume of the former West Virginia State Champion!!

Gatti is like 2 in 1. Against upper echelon, he was a journeyman, but agains middle park, he was competitive and in more cases than not, phenomenal. Mancini belongs somewhere between these groups. My heart tells me that Mancini will win based on better opposition he faced, but Gatti has proved that he feasted on smaller guys(Gatti will probably be 147+ by fight time) and Mancini may be one of them especially since he was so prone to cuts and brawling.

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 04 Oct 2006, 09:50

Neo wrote:
generic screen name wrote:He's better than Marvis Frazier!! He lasted longer against Tyson!!!!!

Scaff fought Tim Witherspoon and Mike Tyson back to back don't underestimate the resume of the former West Virginia State Champion!!
Gatti is like 2 in 1. Against upper echelon, he was a journeyman, but agains middle park, he was competitive and in more cases than not, phenomenal. Mancini belongs somewhere between these groups. My heart tells me that Mancini will win based on better opposition he faced, but Gatti has proved that he feasted on smaller guys(Gatti will probably be 147+ by fight time) and Mancini may be one of them especially since he was so prone to cuts and brawling.

What if they had to weigh in the day of the fight? You know the way it used to be done, and the way it should still be done.

JCS · Post by **JCS** » 04 Oct 2006, 10:06

At 135? I don't think there's more than 1 valid answer to this question.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 04 Oct 2006, 19:46

Decagon wrote:
Neo wrote:
generic screen name wrote:He's better than Marvis Frazier!! He lasted longer against Tyson!!!!!

Scaff fought Tim Witherspoon and Mike Tyson back to back don't underestimate the resume of the former West Virginia State Champion!!
Gatti is like 2 in 1. Against upper echelon, he was a journeyman, but agains middle park, he was competitive and in more cases than not, phenomenal. Mancini belongs somewhere between these groups. My heart tells me that Mancini will win based on better opposition he faced, but Gatti has proved that he feasted on smaller guys(Gatti will probably be 147+ by fight time) and Mancini may be one of them especially since he was so prone to cuts and brawling.
So, Ivan Robinson was an upper-echelon fighter?!?!?!

He was a rated top ten contender and fought for a world title!.... what would you call that?... club fighter??... give us your version of upper echelon!... Orlando Romeo perhaps or George Feeney???...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 04 Oct 2006, 19:57

Decagon wrote:The only reason he was top rated is that he barely beat an alcoholic clubfighter.

So Orlando Romeo who gave Mancini hell was world class was he?... and George Feeney???.... have you even seen these fights?... 8)

or any fights for that matter! 8)

Neo · Post by **Neo** » 05 Oct 2006, 04:27

The Great John L wrote:
Neo wrote:
generic screen name wrote:He's better than Marvis Frazier!! He lasted longer against Tyson!!!!!

Scaff fought Tim Witherspoon and Mike Tyson back to back don't underestimate the resume of the former West Virginia State Champion!!
Gatti is like 2 in 1. Against upper echelon, he was a journeyman, but agains middle park, he was competitive and in more cases than not, phenomenal. Mancini belongs somewhere between these groups. My heart tells me that Mancini will win based on better opposition he faced, but Gatti has proved that he feasted on smaller guys(Gatti will probably be 147+ by fight time) and Mancini may be one of them especially since he was so prone to cuts and brawling.
What if they had to weigh in the day of the fight? You know the way it used to be done, and the way it should still be done.

It should be but it is not.

Neo · Post by **Neo** » 05 Oct 2006, 04:43

Decagon wrote:
Neo wrote:
generic screen name wrote:He's better than Marvis Frazier!! He lasted longer against Tyson!!!!!

Scaff fought Tim Witherspoon and Mike Tyson back to back don't underestimate the resume of the former West Virginia State Champion!!
Gatti is like 2 in 1. Against upper echelon, he was a journeyman, but agains middle park, he was competitive and in more cases than not, phenomenal. Mancini belongs somewhere between these groups. My heart tells me that Mancini will win based on better opposition he faced, but Gatti has proved that he feasted on smaller guys(Gatti will probably be 147+ by fight time) and Mancini may be one of them especially since he was so prone to cuts and brawling.
So, Ivan Robinson was an upper-echelon fighter?!?!?!

PBF, PBF,PBF, Baldo. He received frightful beating in those fights. He was exactly what Floyd called him before their fight.

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 05 Oct 2006, 11:17

Decagon wrote:
silkov wrote:I'm sure I've never seen the wins Andrew Golota had that led you to believe that he was one of the top 10 fighters of the 1990s.

I thought silky had Golota as one of the top 10 heavies of the 90’s. Still a stretch, but more defensible than one of the top 10 fighters of the 90’s.

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 05 Oct 2006, 11:23

Decagon wrote:…Pernell Whitaker would have a tough time beating Michael Grant, and all that.

Well, maybe that’s not such a great example…

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Oct 2006, 11:53

Decagon wrote:
silkov wrote:
Decagon wrote:The only reason he was top rated is that he barely beat an alcoholic clubfighter.
So Orlando Romeo who gave Mancini hell was world class was he?... and George Feeney???.... have you even seen these fights?... 8)
or any fights for that matter! 8)
I'm sure I've never seen the wins Andrew Golota had that led you to believe that he was one of the top 10 fighters of the 1990s.

I said he was one of the top 10 heavyweights of the 90s actually... your mind is going mate, ...why do you care so much what I say anyway?... quit following me around like some stalker

and get a life!..

8) .

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Oct 2006, 11:54

Decagon wrote:That's what I meant. I usually look at who the best fighters are from an absolute sense, not a pound-for-pound sense. Pernell Whitaker would have a tough time beating Michael Grant, and all that.

So that means that Pernell is not as good a fighter does it??? dah!...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Oct 2006, 11:57

Decagon wrote:
silkov wrote:
Decagon wrote:The only reason he was top rated is that he barely beat an alcoholic clubfighter.
So Orlando Romeo who gave Mancini hell was world class was he?... and George Feeney???.... have you even seen these fights?... 8)
or any fights for that matter! 8)
I'm sure I've never seen the wins Andrew Golota had that led you to believe that he was one of the top 10 fighters of the 1990s.

You still havent answered my question about Mancinis opposition?.... if you watch Gattis and Mancinis fights you'd see that if anything Gatti faced the better opponents in his prime... but then I suppose all this would be a bit too complicated for you to work out!... 8)

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Oct 2006, 12:31

Decagon wrote:Sure, he faced better opposition, but he didn't beat better opposition. That's what really counts.

Look again, or rather tell me who Ray beat that was so special?... the best fighters that Mancini fought all beat him... theres very little to choose between Gatti and Mancini and if you watched their fights perhaps you'd see this though I doubt it...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Oct 2006, 12:48

Decagon wrote:Stop with the accusations. I grew up watching Mancini. I wrote an article about the influence of his match with Kim Duk-koo on my generation.

Well then you;re just blinded by bias... you're the one constantly going on about this when I actually said earlier we should agree to disagree... I've said myself that Mancini has the edge on Gatti as a fighter, but its just that, an edge, if Gattis a clubfighter as you say then so is Mancini, simple as that, take off your rose tinted glasses mate... you've still failed to come up with any concrete argument that Mancini beat more impressive opposition to Gatti... probably because he didnt...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Oct 2006, 12:53

I dont know what your problem is with Gatti, but to call him a clubfighter while you seem to worship Mancinis farts is the height of stupidity... anyone would think we were comparing Ali and Herbie Hide instaed of two fighters who had very simular careers and very simular ability... and any unbiased person with a decent amount of boxing knowledge would agree with me I am sure...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 06 Oct 2006, 07:34

Decagon wrote:Who's worshipping Mancini? I just said that he was a lot better than Gatti. Nearly everyone is.

And wheres the evidence for Mancini being 'a lot better' than Gatti??... you're just coming out with biased assumptions... wheres your argument??... you still havent answered my question about the great fighters that Mancini beat?... where are they??... the best fighters Ray fought beat him... people like Romeo, Torres etc were barely world class... while Gatti actually beat exworld champions... to say Mancini was a lot better than Gatti shows you are either biased as hell or havent got a clue what youre going on about....

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 06 Oct 2006, 08:42

Not everyone, but you are, as for accusing why dont you stop blowing a gasket and tell me what makes Mancini such a better fighter than Gatti?... and why does it mean so much to you??... christ I've actually said that I give mancini a slight edge in ability but to say he's miles ahead of Gatti as a fighter is just stupid and yes, biased... theres no logical reason to praise Mancini so much yet put down Gatti... the only retard here is you... you act as if you are disturbed or something, get a grip man...

Ambling Alp · Post by **Ambling Alp** » 06 Oct 2006, 13:17

Gatti did more good fighters than Mancini did in his short career. However, Mancini did beat Ramirez, who was better than anyone that Gatti beat. Mancini also should have gotten the decision against Camach. Mancini also was somewhat competitive with Arguello. Gatti wasn't competitive when he fought the real elite competition.

Neither Gatti or Mancini did quite enough to be in the Hall of Fame.(Though there are a handful of Hall of Famers that weren't as good as Gatti or Mancini).

A head to head matchup would have been a war. Both were ultra aggressive, had good power, good chins,lots of heart and very little defense.

Mancini seemed to be the slightly harder puncher and had the better chin. Mancini would probably stop Gatti in 7-10 rounds in an exciting fight.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 06 Oct 2006, 16:31

Decagon wrote:Mancini always trained for the fights he had, unlike Gatti, who often showed up to the gym drunk as hell and drank wine out of a plastic cup.

You probably would have got on well with him then...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 06 Oct 2006, 16:33

Decagon wrote:Mancini always trained for the fights he had, unlike Gatti, who often showed up to the gym drunk as hell and drank wine out of a plastic cup.

I'm still waiting for some semblance of a sane argument from you to support your views!... obviously thats far beyond your scope... I think you should go back to your rankings, God knows they need some attention!...

8)

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 06 Oct 2006, 19:41

Decagon wrote:
silkov wrote:
Decagon wrote:Mancini always trained for the fights he had, unlike Gatti, who often showed up to the gym drunk as hell and drank wine out of a plastic cup.
You probably would have got on well with him then...
I'm on Percocet for cholecystitis and pleurisy, and I'm on disability. I spent Saturday night in the hospital. I may not be all there all the time, and my short-term memory is shit, but I'm no alky. Let's see how you'd do with your right kidney, gallbladder and right lung not working.

I'll be mountain biking before the year is up.

Well as you know I have sympathy for your ill health but that doesnt change the fact that you attitude about Gatti is totally misguided... like I said before give me the reasons why Mancini is such a superior fighter to Gatti, if you cant come up with anything then theres no point continuing with this discussion...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 07 Oct 2006, 21:17

Decagon wrote:Calling me a drunk simply because I'm groggy from medicine is uncalled for. You're an asshole, Silkov.

I never said you were a drunk, but you keep going on like you know so much about Gattis drinking that I thought maybe you're an expert on the subject?.... if you are such a teetotal guy then what gives you the authority to talk about such things??.... if Gatti was an alcoholic than far from denegrating him he should be praised even more for what he's acheived in the ring and for turning his career around when he looked to be washed up... alcoholism is a disease, and to knock a fighter who has fought such a disease and has given so much to boxing through his career makes you an arsehole imo...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 08 Oct 2006, 05:44

Jesus, get a grip mate, being sick is no excuse for behaving like you are, you're behaving like a troll, why do you care what I think about Gatti and Mancini anyway if I'm such a bad bad person?... because I really dont care what you think about them mate, as youre so blatantly biased and ill informed that its embarrasing... I mean Byrd better than Jimmy Young??... now thats retarded!... read through this thread, you're the one whose been insulting and whining, all the way through, ....if you want to talk boxing normally without the hysterics fine but till then I'm done talking with you!... I hope you get over youre illness but you should stop whining about it all the time and using it as an excuse for bahaving like an arsehole.... have a nice day.

8)

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 08 Oct 2006, 09:44

You're really out of control mate, you've messed up a good thread here with your incoherent ramblings, yet you tell me to 'talk about boxing'! ....very funny indeed, as for lying, you said Byrd was better than Young! I read it... you also said that the 30s and 50s eras were weak, ...I suppose you're denying that now!.
Anyway, you're boring me now..

. have a nice day!... 8)