The Heavyweight Champions

[gilgamesh]

As of now. This would be my Top 21. This DOES NOT mean I consider these guys to be the 21 Best Heavyweights ever. It just means this is the order I'd have the fighters I've covered in. Any names not included haven't been covered yet.

Heavyweight
1. Muhammad Ali - 1107 points
2. Joe Louis - 899 points
3. George Foreman - 694 points
4. Larry Holmes - 576 points
5. Rocky Marciano - 474 points
6. Lennox Lewis - 470 Points
7. Evander Holyfield - 466 Points
8. Riddick Bowe - 448 points
9. Wladimir Klitschko - 416 points
10. Mike Tyson - 377 points
11. Joe Frazier - 353 points
12. Tyson Fury - 342 points
13. Sonny Liston - 284 points
14. Vitali Klitschko - 265 points
15. Tommy Morrison - 241 points
16. Anthony Joshua - 223 Points
17. Deontay Wilder - 221 points
18. Oleksandr Usyk - 211 points
19. Ken Norton - 169 points
20. Frank Bruno - 130 points
21. Fabio Wardley - 110 points

Usyk behind Tommy Morrison and wilder shows fundamental flaws.

Here's the version of the list that stands now with more names having been added, and a few more fights having been fought for some of the people on the list.

Heavyweight
1. Muhammad Ali - 1107 points
2. Joe Louis - 899 points
3. George Foreman - 694 points
4. Larry Holmes - 576 points
5. Lennox Lewis - 500 points
6. Rocky Marciano - 474 points
7. Evander Holyfield - 461 Points
8. Riddick Bowe - 448 points
9. Wladimir Klitschko - 426 points
10. Mike Tyson - 397 points
11. Joe Frazier - 353 points
12. Tyson Fury - 346 points
13. Sonny Liston - 284 points
14. Oleksandr Usyk - 266 points
15. Vitali Klitschko - 265 points
16. Jack Dempsey - 264 points
17. Jim Jeffries - 249 points
18. Jack Johnson - 246 points
19. Tommy Morrison - 241 points
20 (tied). Deontay Wilder - 227 points
20 (tied). David Tua - 227 points
22. Anthony Joshua - 223 Points
23. Ezzard Charles - 221 points
24. Gene Tunney - 206 points
25. Floyd Patterson - 198 points
26. Andy Ruiz - 188 points
27. Ken Norton - 169 points
28. Hasim Rahman - 168 points
29. Joseph Parker - 149 points
30. Tommy Burns - 147 points
31. Ray Mercer - 145 points
32. Daniel Dubois - 139 points
33. Frank Bruno - 130 points
34. Max Schmeling - 129 points
35. Primo Carnera - 120 points
36 (tied). Jersey Joe Walcott - 113 points
36 (tied) . Ingemar Johansson - 113 points
38. James "Buster" Douglas - 97 points
39. Michael Moorer - 96 points
40. Tim Witherspoon - 94 points
41. Michael Spinks - 92 points
42. Max Baer - 91 points
43. Fabio Wardley - 90 points
44. Michael Dokes - 88 points
45. Jess Willard - 75 points
46. Jack Sharkey - 31 points
47. Roy Jones Jr. - 11 points
48. Samuel Peter - 6 points
49. Pinklon Thomas - 5 points

[gilgamesh]

If I'm not mistaken Agit Kabayel has now been upgraded to WBC Champion with Usyk's having vacated the Title. He will be added to the list of Heavyweight titlists.

Still to be determined if he ever successfully defends the title.

[tiny_acres]

As of now. This would be my Top 21. This DOES NOT mean I consider these guys to be the 21 Best Heavyweights ever. It just means this is the order I'd have the fighters I've covered in. Any names not included haven't been covered yet.

Heavyweight
1. Muhammad Ali - 1107 points
2. Joe Louis - 899 points
3. George Foreman - 694 points
4. Larry Holmes - 576 points
5. Rocky Marciano - 474 points
6. Lennox Lewis - 470 Points
7. Evander Holyfield - 466 Points
8. Riddick Bowe - 448 points
9. Wladimir Klitschko - 416 points
10. Mike Tyson - 377 points
11. Joe Frazier - 353 points
12. Tyson Fury - 342 points
13. Sonny Liston - 284 points
14. Vitali Klitschko - 265 points
15. Tommy Morrison - 241 points
16. Anthony Joshua - 223 Points
17. Deontay Wilder - 221 points
18. Oleksandr Usyk - 211 points
19. Ken Norton - 169 points
20. Frank Bruno - 130 points
21. Fabio Wardley - 110 points

Usyk behind Tommy Morrison and wilder shows fundamental flaws.

Here's the version of the list that stands now with more names having been added, and a few more fights having been fought for some of the people on the list.

Heavyweight
1. Muhammad Ali - 1107 points
2. Joe Louis - 899 points
3. George Foreman - 694 points
4. Larry Holmes - 576 points
5. Lennox Lewis - 500 points
6. Rocky Marciano - 474 points
7. Evander Holyfield - 461 Points
8. Riddick Bowe - 448 points
9. Wladimir Klitschko - 426 points
10. Mike Tyson - 397 points
11. Joe Frazier - 353 points
12. Tyson Fury - 346 points
13. Sonny Liston - 284 points
14. Oleksandr Usyk - 266 points
15. Vitali Klitschko - 265 points
16. Jack Dempsey - 264 points
17. Jim Jeffries - 249 points
18. Jack Johnson - 246 points
19. Tommy Morrison - 241 points
20 (tied). Deontay Wilder - 227 points
20 (tied). David Tua - 227 points
22. Anthony Joshua - 223 Points
23. Ezzard Charles - 221 points
24. Gene Tunney - 206 points
25. Floyd Patterson - 198 points
26. Andy Ruiz - 188 points
27. Ken Norton - 169 points
28. Hasim Rahman - 168 points
29. Joseph Parker - 149 points
30. Tommy Burns - 147 points
31. Ray Mercer - 145 points
32. Daniel Dubois - 139 points
33. Frank Bruno - 130 points
34. Max Schmeling - 129 points
35. Primo Carnera - 120 points
36 (tied). Jersey Joe Walcott - 113 points
36 (tied) . Ingemar Johansson - 113 points
38. James "Buster" Douglas - 97 points
39. Michael Moorer - 96 points
40. Tim Witherspoon - 94 points
41. Michael Spinks - 92 points
42. Max Baer - 91 points
43. Fabio Wardley - 90 points
44. Michael Dokes - 88 points
45. Jess Willard - 75 points
46. Jack Sharkey - 31 points
47. Roy Jones Jr. - 11 points
48. Samuel Peter - 6 points
49. Pinklon Thomas - 5 points

Curious as to why Pinklon only has 5 points

[Ambling Alp II]

Didn't have enough "accomplishments". Doesn't matter that he was better than a ton of guys who are ranked higher.

[gilgamesh]

Usyk behind Tommy Morrison and wilder shows fundamental flaws.

Here's the version of the list that stands now with more names having been added, and a few more fights having been fought for some of the people on the list.

Heavyweight
1. Muhammad Ali - 1107 points
2. Joe Louis - 899 points
3. George Foreman - 694 points
4. Larry Holmes - 576 points
5. Lennox Lewis - 500 points
6. Rocky Marciano - 474 points
7. Evander Holyfield - 461 Points
8. Riddick Bowe - 448 points
9. Wladimir Klitschko - 426 points
10. Mike Tyson - 397 points
11. Joe Frazier - 353 points
12. Tyson Fury - 346 points
13. Sonny Liston - 284 points
14. Oleksandr Usyk - 266 points
15. Vitali Klitschko - 265 points
16. Jack Dempsey - 264 points
17. Jim Jeffries - 249 points
18. Jack Johnson - 246 points
19. Tommy Morrison - 241 points
20 (tied). Deontay Wilder - 227 points
20 (tied). David Tua - 227 points
22. Anthony Joshua - 223 Points
23. Ezzard Charles - 221 points
24. Gene Tunney - 206 points
25. Floyd Patterson - 198 points
26. Andy Ruiz - 188 points
27. Ken Norton - 169 points
28. Hasim Rahman - 168 points
29. Joseph Parker - 149 points
30. Tommy Burns - 147 points
31. Ray Mercer - 145 points
32. Daniel Dubois - 139 points
33. Frank Bruno - 130 points
34. Max Schmeling - 129 points
35. Primo Carnera - 120 points
36 (tied). Jersey Joe Walcott - 113 points
36 (tied) . Ingemar Johansson - 113 points
38. James "Buster" Douglas - 97 points
39. Michael Moorer - 96 points
40. Tim Witherspoon - 94 points
41. Michael Spinks - 92 points
42. Max Baer - 91 points
43. Fabio Wardley - 90 points
44. Michael Dokes - 88 points
45. Jess Willard - 75 points
46. Jack Sharkey - 31 points
47. Roy Jones Jr. - 11 points
48. Samuel Peter - 6 points
49. Pinklon Thomas - 5 points

Curious as to why Pinklon only has 5 points

Lots of KO losses mainly. The same thing caused Oleg Maskaev not to even wind up on the positive side of the ledger. Pinklon would rate higher for me if I could find more footage of his winning performances, but unfortunately I could only track down about a Dozen of the bouts he came out on top in.

[gilgamesh]

Didn't have enough "accomplishments". Doesn't matter that he was better than a ton of guys who are ranked higher.

I would favor Pinklon to win quite a few Mythical bouts with the people rated ahead of him yes, but my rankings aren't based on Mythical results. They're based on real world ones.

Fighters from past eras are sometimes short changed by there being less footage readily available of them, but that can't be helped.

[gilgamesh]

And to be clear I have rated some fighters lower than Pinklon Thomas, I just didn't wind up putting them on the list at all.

So far Marvin Hart, Oleg Maskaev and Michael Bentt would be the guys that have finished below Pinklon Thomas. I'm pretty sure Leon Spinks, Mike Weaver and Bonecrusher Smith will wind up joining them in the Unrated list below Pinklon Thomas.

This thread really wasn't intended to be a discussion about how I'm ranking these guys though. It's just meant to be a List of who the various Heavyweight Champions and Titleholders are in Chronological order. Anytime a new name is added to the list I'll bump the thread, and update the Post on Page 1 with the new Champion.

[gilgamesh]

Apparently Murat Gassiev has now also been elevated to the status of being the only WBA Heavyweight Champion. So he gets added to the list of titlists.

Crazy to think that 3 men have been gifted a version of the Heavyweight Championship in the last Calendar year. This feels like a moment that should kinda signal the beginning of the end of the Title orgs, and a shift to a new way of Championship recognition in a new era. We'll see how that all plays out.

[gilgamesh]

A new name will be added to the Heavyweight Titlist list following Itauma vs Hrgovic this Saturday

[Caractacus]

The 'Loose ends" of the Heavyweight Champion fights.
Gene Tunney should have stuck around long enough to defend the title against Jack Sharkey.
A lot of people were looking forward to that fight.
What if Jack Sharkey had not been disqualified against Max Schmeling ?
(Ray Arcel had once said Jack Sharkey had been the best HW he had seen in his lifetime,
I thnk Whitey Bimstein had said the same thing)
Max Baer vrs Jack Sharkey for the HW title would have been a good one.
and Primo Carnera vrs Max Schmeling for a shot at the title would have been interesting

[Caractacus]

Wasn't Jimmy Bivens declared some sort of "State-Side" HW Champion during WW II ?

[Caractacus]

and what if Max Baer had not hurt his right hand before facing James J. Braddock
and Max Baer had won that fight ? (if only by desion .Who had Baer defended the title from next in line ?
Would he had fought Joe Louis at some point as HW Champion ?

[gilgamesh]

Filip Hrgovic joins the list of Heavyweight Tilist with his upset win today over Moses Itauma, and is the 1st ever Heavyweight Champion from Croatia.

[SteveO]

October 1942: The NBA announced that during reigning champion Joe Louis’ tour of duty in the U.S army the heavyweight title would be ‘frozen’. The American states of Maryland and Ohio decided to hold contests to find a ‘Duration’ heavyweight champion.
1st December 1943 Jimmy Bivins beat Lee Q Murray for the 'duration' title.

[gilgamesh]

That's as credible if not more so than Lee Savold's reign, but since it's essentially an Interim title and I don't recognize those, I don't recognize that one as a Legit World Title.

I wouldn't begin to want to keep up with every Interim and Regular and Silver Champion there's ever been

[Ambling Alp II]

The 'Loose ends" of the Heavyweight Champion fights.
Gene Tunney should have stuck around long enough to defend the title against Jack Sharkey.
A lot of people were looking forward to that fight.
What if Jack Sharkey had not been disqualified against Max Schmeling ?
(Ray Arcel had once said Jack Sharkey had been the best HW he had seen in his lifetime,
I thnk Whitey Bimstein had said the same thing)
Max Baer vrs Jack Sharkey for the HW title would have been a good one.
and Primo Carnera vrs Max Schmeling for a shot at the title would have been interesting

The Tunney not fighting Sharkey thing is a long boxing myth. Sharkey was the #4 contender when Tunney retried.

It's too bad that the Schmeling-Sharkey fights were both controversial.
Baer-Sharkey would have been a good one. I remember before I ever posted on Boxrec, I read a post where two people were arguing over that one, both making good points. Those days are long gone.

Carnera-Schmeling might have been a good one.

[gilgamesh]

Baer vs Sharkey would've been a brawl for sure. Baer probably edges it with the advantage of Youth on his side. Not to mention I figure he was just better than Sharkey anyhow even both at their best.

Tunney vs Schmeling would've been a really interesting tactical chess match unlike many matches you would've seen at that time. Tunney was probably wise to have called it a career when he did. As talented as he was the body can only do so much and with the amount of fights he already had under his belt. He could probably feel his reflexes beginning to slow and things like that.

[Expug]

Gene also married into a very wealthy family while champ.
He promised Polly Lauder who was an heiress with the Carnegie steel family, he’d hang them up.
After a great career, beating Dempsey , Greb,etc,
And now never having to worry about money again, he may have said to himself,” why do I need this”?

[Caractacus]

The 'Loose ends" of the Heavyweight Champion fights.
Gene Tunney should have stuck around long enough to defend the title against Jack Sharkey.
A lot of people were looking forward to that fight.
What if Jack Sharkey had not been disqualified against Max Schmeling ?
(Ray Arcel had once said Jack Sharkey had been the best HW he had seen in his lifetime,
I thnk Whitey Bimstein had said the same thing)
Max Baer vrs Jack Sharkey for the HW title would have been a good one.
and Primo Carnera vrs Max Schmeling for a shot at the title would have been interesting

The Tunney not fighting Sharkey thing is a long boxing myth. Sharkey was the #4 contender when Tunney retried.

It's too bad that the Schmeling-Sharkey fights were both controversial.
Baer-Sharkey would have been a good one. I remember before I ever posted on Boxrec, I read a post where two people were arguing over that one, both making good points. Those days are long gone.

Carnera-Schmeling might have been a good one.

yeah, but those fights he lost were pretty much sh*t nowwhere fights.
Jack Sharkey would have definately been motivated to fight for the HW Championship of the World.
What other HW had been more popular with the fans (after Jack Dempsey of course) i arsk.
The public had been "clamouring" for a Sharkey vrs Tunney fight.

[SteveO]

That's as credible if not more so than Lee Savold's reign, but since it's essentially an Interim title and I don't recognize those, I don't recognize that one as a Legit World Title.

I wouldn't begin to want to keep up with every Interim and Regular and Silver Champion there's ever been

Totally agree with you on all of that

[Ambling Alp II]

The 'Loose ends" of the Heavyweight Champion fights.
Gene Tunney should have stuck around long enough to defend the title against Jack Sharkey.
A lot of people were looking forward to that fight.
What if Jack Sharkey had not been disqualified against Max Schmeling ?
(Ray Arcel had once said Jack Sharkey had been the best HW he had seen in his lifetime,
I thnk Whitey Bimstein had said the same thing)
Max Baer vrs Jack Sharkey for the HW title would have been a good one.
and Primo Carnera vrs Max Schmeling for a shot at the title would have been interesting

The Tunney not fighting Sharkey thing is a long boxing myth. Sharkey was the #4 contender when Tunney retried.

It's too bad that the Schmeling-Sharkey fights were both controversial.
Baer-Sharkey would have been a good one. I remember before I ever posted on Boxrec, I read a post where two people were arguing over that one, both making good points. Those days are long gone.

Carnera-Schmeling might have been a good one.

yeah, but those fights he lost were pretty much sh*t nowwhere fights.
Jack Sharkey would have definately been motivated to fight for the HW Championship of the World.
What other HW had been more popular with the fans (after Jack Dempsey of course) i arsk.
The public had been "clamouring" for a Sharkey vrs Tunney fight.

sh*t nowhere fights?
What are you talking about? Since when is New York nowhere?
Sharkey had three big fights in a row in 1927 and 1928 when Tunney was the champion.

In 1927, he got ko'd by Dempsey at Yankee Stadium. (This was between the two Dempsey-Tunney fights) It was an elimination fight. If Sharkey had won, he would have got a title shot against Tunney.

In his next fight in January 1928, at Madison Square Garden, Sharkey had a draw with Tom Heeney.
Then in March 1928, he fought in Madison Square Garden against Johnny Risko. He lost the decision.

0-2-1 in three big fights. That moved him down the ladder.

[Caractacus]

He lost to Dempsey (practically) on a foul so that can be over-looked.
a "draw' should not detract from his record either.
BTW then why didnt Tunney fight Johnny Risko then ?
He was pretty good.

[Ambling Alp II]

He got knocked out by Dempsey. It's his own fault that he complained to the referee after he thought he was fouled and got clocked.
A draw should not detract from his record? huh? It's not as bad a loss, but it's not as good as a win. If you can only get a draw against another contender, that is normally going to set you back.

Why didn't Risko get a title shot? Well, he did beat Sharkey and he did beat Godfrey as well. But in October of 1927, he lost to, guess who? Heeney.
The guy who the title shot against Tunney? Guess who? Heeney. Nobody was head and shoulders above the rest, but Heeney was the most deserving challenger in 1928.

[Expug]

Sharkey turning to the referee and complaining about Dempseys low blow is a head scratcher.
Experienced guy like that it’s hard to figure.
The referee tells you during instructions “ protect yourself at all times”.
He’s not kidding

[gilgamesh]

Sharkey turning to the referee and complaining about Dempseys low blow is a head scratcher.
Experienced guy like that it’s hard to figure.
The referee tells you during instructions “ protect yourself at all times”.
He’s not kidding

I personally always kinda like it when someone nails a guy when he's turning to the ref to complain because honestly that's the kinda sh*t I'd do if I was fighting. I ain't your buddy in a fight. I want to win.